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Post by nott1 on Jun 13, 2019 5:57:30 GMT
It’s beginning to be clear that the barrier of exiting players is growing in significance , I can see August being a very busy transfer month for us Not if they decide to stay!
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Post by bloodtypered on Jun 13, 2019 6:58:18 GMT
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Post by liathroid on Jun 13, 2019 7:04:41 GMT
www.stokesentinel.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/stoke-city-pelly-ruddock-luton-2972217Stoke City hold an interest in Luton talisman Pelly-Ruddock Mpanzu – but will need to clear the decks if they are to re-balance their midfield department. Mark Cartwright’s team of scouts have been casting their nets far and wide as they look to find the right players for Nathan Jones's diamond system. They have been tracking a highly-rated young German midfielder but would face fierce competition for his signature. And Jones knows he can rely on Ruddock, aged 25, to operate anywhere in his diamond, including in the key defensive role. They haven't pointed out which one his is in the photo. Possibly the guy with glasses from Revenge of the Nerds or the old fella on the right .It definately isn't the fella back right of the pic as that's the guitar player from Bow Wow Wow
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jun 13, 2019 7:20:43 GMT
Absolute rubbish Definitely not fit but he won tons in the air I thought he looked awful as a targetman in the traditional sense. Chest and feet yes, head? No way. Pumping a ball up to a target man's head is park football. Vokes comes into his own as a target man when the ball is played to his chest or feet when he can do something more constructive than just a hopeful flick on. The problem isn't Vokes - it's the defence pumping hopeful balls into the air. Play the right ball to Vokes and he's a very effective target man.
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jun 13, 2019 7:26:21 GMT
Definitely the right type of build and style to suit the CDM role or that of a CM Carrilero, mobile, strong and a good passer of the ball
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jun 13, 2019 7:26:36 GMT
Top German midfielders from Bundesliga II (Aged 24 and under) Top Tacklers:Atakan Karazor - Holstein Kiel Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Maximilian Thalhammer - Jahn Regensburg Top Interceptors:Lukas Fröde - Duisburg Paul Jaeckel - Greuther Fuerth Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Top Passers:Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn *Disclaimer. Before anyone starts crying. They are basic stats from whoscored.com, it's a bit of fun and if you don't like it, block me. Dorsch was the name I'd plumped for after my quick google! We have to go for Maximilian Thalhammer - and while we're at it bring in Wolverine and Nightcrawler - who'd be brilliant ghosting at the far post..
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Post by FullerMagic on Jun 13, 2019 8:29:46 GMT
So the gist of the story seems to be we shouldn't be holding our breath for any midfield additions (even the apparently key defensive midfielder?) until we've cleared the decks of some of the big earners?
And the last line of the story is interesting too:
A big fee for Jack Butland, who has now been linked to Bournemouth, Crystal Palace and Aston Villa, would help Stoke to grease the wheels on exit deals.
So bank the big money for Butland, which helps us to facilitate the exits of the high-earning dirty dozen that we want to shift- and then we can start to add people on decent deals?
Maybe Butland is the first domino that needs to fall?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 13, 2019 9:08:23 GMT
I thought he looked awful as a targetman in the traditional sense. Chest and feet yes, head? No way. Pumping a ball up to a target man's head is park football. Vokes comes into his own as a target man when the ball is played to his chest or feet when he can do something more constructive than just a hopeful flick on. The problem isn't Vokes - it's the defence pumping hopeful balls into the air. Play the right ball to Vokes and he's a very effective target man. The problem is the manager instructing them to do that.
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Post by jimmygscfc on Jun 13, 2019 9:25:43 GMT
He looks like an attacking/central midfielder to me, so we'd still need a DM.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jun 13, 2019 10:28:36 GMT
Pumping a ball up to a target man's head is park football. Vokes comes into his own as a target man when the ball is played to his chest or feet when he can do something more constructive than just a hopeful flick on. The problem isn't Vokes - it's the defence pumping hopeful balls into the air. Play the right ball to Vokes and he's a very effective target man. The problem is the manager instructing them to do that. Hmmm. And you know that for certain? It certainly was plan B under successive managers while we had Crouch on the bench but I can't see how it makes sense with players we have now. It will be interesting to see if that's still the tactic at the start of next season or whether Jones manages to drill it out of them over the summer. Until then I'll reserve judgement as to whether it is Jones or the players not adapting to each others strengths.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 13, 2019 10:37:02 GMT
The problem is the manager instructing them to do that. Hmmm. And you know that for certain? It certainly was plan B under successive managers while we had Crouch on the bench but I can't see how it makes sense with players we have now. It will be interesting to see if that's still the tactic at the start of next season or whether Jones manages to drill it out of them over the summer. Until then I'll reserve judgement as to whether it is Jones or the players not adapting to each others strengths. Yes. And if it isn't our tactics certainly dictate it. Our midfield sporadically offer to get the ball. We used Batth an awful lot when he signed on the ball. So that was either an instruction or teams funnelled the ball to him with their pressining. Either way that was bad as Batth is dreadful on it and panics. I think with Jones he likes to mix it up but when it goes to Batth certainly, you can't predict where the ball will go.
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Post by jimmygscfc on Jun 13, 2019 11:01:00 GMT
You really don't rate Baath at all do you?
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Post by knype on Jun 13, 2019 11:59:48 GMT
You really don't rate Baath at all do you? He nevers rates anyone unless another team signs them!
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Post by tony1234 on Jun 13, 2019 13:52:03 GMT
Top German midfielders from Bundesliga II (Aged 24 and under) Top Tacklers:Atakan Karazor - Holstein Kiel Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Maximilian Thalhammer - Jahn Regensburg Top Interceptors:Lukas Fröde - Duisburg Paul Jaeckel - Greuther Fuerth Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Top Passers:Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn *Disclaimer. Before anyone starts crying. They are basic stats from whoscored.com, it's a bit of fun and if you don't like it, block me. Might it be any of the St Pauli players? Finn Ole Becker, 19 Jakob Munzner, 19 Luis Coordes, 20
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Post by tony1234 on Jun 13, 2019 13:55:36 GMT
Vokes has been awful as a targetman so far. And because they’re two massively different managers with different requirements. Do you think? Considering he was massively unfit, you could see he was going to be a big asset in the air. The stats show he was one of the most dominant players aerially in the league Most of the leagues' best strikers are in or close to the lower-left quadrant!? Is this graph telling us that being a better striker is pretty much independent of the ability to win aerial duels? The top right sees a fair few pretty ineffectual "lumps"
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Post by themistocles on Jun 13, 2019 13:58:47 GMT
Top German midfielders from Bundesliga II (Aged 24 and under) Top Tacklers:Atakan Karazor - Holstein Kiel Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Maximilian Thalhammer - Jahn Regensburg Top Interceptors:Lukas Fröde - Duisburg Paul Jaeckel - Greuther Fuerth Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Top Passers:Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn *Disclaimer. Before anyone starts crying. They are basic stats from whoscored.com, it's a bit of fun and if you don't like it, block me. Might it be any of the St Pauli players? Finn Ole Becker, 19 Jakob Munzner, 19 Luis Coordes, 20 Would be my guess
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Post by vahl on Jun 13, 2019 14:05:22 GMT
Do you think? Considering he was massively unfit, you could see he was going to be a big asset in the air. The stats show he was one of the most dominant players aerially in the league Most of the leagues' best strikers are in or close to the lower-left quadrant!? Is this graph telling us that being a better striker is pretty much independent of the ability to win aerial duels? The top right sees a fair few pretty ineffectual "lumps" It does pretty much conclude that the best players in the air are the most ineffectual, yes. It's good to see Gregory in the 'hot spot' though.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 13, 2019 14:29:04 GMT
You really don't rate Baath at all do you? He's ok. He can defend but awful on the ball. We need better I think but good to have in the squad.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 13, 2019 14:30:05 GMT
You really don't rate Baath at all do you? He nevers rates anyone unless another team signs them! Not true. As with Batth, he's ok, he's limited but does a job. We need better and have better.
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Post by jimmygscfc on Jun 13, 2019 14:41:51 GMT
Yeah, we know...
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jun 13, 2019 14:43:23 GMT
Do you think? Considering he was massively unfit, you could see he was going to be a big asset in the air. The stats show he was one of the most dominant players aerially in the league Most of the leagues' best strikers are in or close to the lower-left quadrant!? Is this graph telling us that being a better striker is pretty much independent of the ability to win aerial duels? The top right sees a fair few pretty ineffectual "lumps" I'd say it speaks more about the tactics that certain teams employ. None of the promoted sides this year were particularly reliant on target men and aerial wing play. Horses for courses, I'd Imagine Mama Sidibe would have been in the top right quad, but in spite of his goal return he was absolutely integral for how that team played. Graphs like this are superb, and I do love looking at them. But stats like this should always be used in context. It's why players like Micheal Keane get blown up to be the next big thing when in reality their stats are so high because of Burnley's commitment to a heavily defensive game. Put him in a more expansive team like Keane at Everton and he looks like half the player.
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Post by FranktheRabbit on Jun 13, 2019 15:06:43 GMT
He nevers rates anyone unless another team signs them! Not true. As with Batth, he's ok, he's limited but does a job. We need better and have better. We have better defenders than Batth?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2019 15:28:54 GMT
Top German midfielders from Bundesliga II (Aged 24 and under) Top Tacklers:Atakan Karazor - Holstein Kiel Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Maximilian Thalhammer - Jahn Regensburg Top Interceptors:Lukas Fröde - Duisburg Paul Jaeckel - Greuther Fuerth Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn Top Passers:Niklas Dorsch - FC Heidenheim Sebastian Schonlau - Paderborn *Disclaimer. Before anyone starts crying. They are basic stats from whoscored.com, it's a bit of fun and if you don't like it, block me. Might it be any of the St Pauli players? Finn Ole Becker, 19 Jakob Munzner, 19 Luis Coordes, 20 If it was anyone from St Pauli, you'd have to guess at Ersin Zehir. Same agent as Kevin Wimmer.
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Post by nott1 on Jun 13, 2019 16:30:38 GMT
Might it be any of the St Pauli players? Finn Ole Becker, 19 Jakob Munzner, 19 Luis Coordes, 20 If it was anyone from St Pauli, you'd have to guess at Ersin Zehir. Same agent as Kevin Wimmer. We don't want any players from him then thank you!
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Post by robwahlmann on Jun 13, 2019 16:53:17 GMT
Not true. As with Batth, he's ok, he's limited but does a job. We need better and have better. We have better defenders than Batth? No, we haven't.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Jun 13, 2019 17:21:17 GMT
Hmmm. And you know that for certain? It certainly was plan B under successive managers while we had Crouch on the bench but I can't see how it makes sense with players we have now. It will be interesting to see if that's still the tactic at the start of next season or whether Jones manages to drill it out of them over the summer. Until then I'll reserve judgement as to whether it is Jones or the players not adapting to each others strengths. Yes. And if it isn't our tactics certainly dictate it. Our midfield sporadically offer to get the ball. We used Batth an awful lot when he signed on the ball. So that was either an instruction or teams funnelled the ball to him with their pressining. Either way that was bad as Batth is dreadful on it and panics. I think with Jones he likes to mix it up but when it goes to Batth certainly, you can't predict where the ball will go. Our defence improved significantly when Batth came in and the biggest culprit by far for hopeful, floaty, balls to the striker's head was Shawcross. I agree Batth isn't most the cultured player on the ball but he's far from dreadful. I'd like to see a more cultured player alongside Batth (who I see as first choice CB at the moment) but we can probably get away with a couple of old school CBs if we have a quality DM at the base of the diamond which should also lessen the need for lumping it up front.
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Post by tony1234 on Jun 13, 2019 17:25:55 GMT
Most of the leagues' best strikers are in or close to the lower-left quadrant!? Is this graph telling us that being a better striker is pretty much independent of the ability to win aerial duels? The top right sees a fair few pretty ineffectual "lumps" I'd say it speaks more about the tactics that certain teams employ. None of the promoted sides this year were particularly reliant on target men and aerial wing play. Horses for courses, I'd Imagine Mama Sidibe would have been in the top right quad, but in spite of his goal return he was absolutely integral for how that team played. Graphs like this are superb, and I do love looking at them. But stats like this should always be used in context. It's why players like Micheal Keane get blown up to be the next big thing when in reality their stats are so high because of Burnley's commitment to a heavily defensive game. Put him in a more expansive team like Keane at Everton and he looks like half the player. Well written!
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Post by FranktheRabbit on Jun 13, 2019 17:26:44 GMT
We have better defenders than Batth? No, we haven't. Exactly. I just really don't get Bayern's dislike for the guy.
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Post by robwahlmann on Jun 13, 2019 18:59:40 GMT
Exactly. I just really don't get Bayern's dislike for the guy. In my opinion he was outstanding after his arrival, and I don't think anyone we could have brought in would have done any better. Certainly good value for the money we paid.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 13, 2019 19:00:52 GMT
Yes. And if it isn't our tactics certainly dictate it. Our midfield sporadically offer to get the ball. We used Batth an awful lot when he signed on the ball. So that was either an instruction or teams funnelled the ball to him with their pressining. Either way that was bad as Batth is dreadful on it and panics. I think with Jones he likes to mix it up but when it goes to Batth certainly, you can't predict where the ball will go. Our defence improved significantly when Batth came in and the biggest culprit by far for hopeful, floaty, balls to the striker's head was Shawcross. I agree Batth isn't most the cultured player on the ball but he's far from dreadful. I'd like to see a more cultured player alongside Batth (who I see as first choice CB at the moment) but we can probably get away with a couple of old school CBs if we have a quality DM at the base of the diamond which should also lessen the need for lumping it up front. Because he was told to play them! Batth barely found a Stoke player and when dribbling with it looked frightening. Teams let him have the ball and targeted him.
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