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Post by milky on May 31, 2019 21:44:41 GMT
That well known pragmatist PC made it pretty clear we were going all out to try and get back up at the first attempt and was actually quoted as saying top 6 was the minimum requirement. It became pretty obvious by New Years Day that Rowett wasnt capable of achieving it..in fact he made things worse.Jones then inherited the shit players ( your words not mine )that Rowett inherited plus the ones he had signed.Sure there is a good argument NJ should have done better than he did but like I say he can only be judged after a full pre season with ( hopefully) some ins and outs.Surely that's fair ? Its the only way the 2 managers can be compared. You cant claim Rowett did a fantastic job to keep us out of the bottom 3 then suddenly move the goalposts when Jones arrives. Bottom line , Rowett was a disaster given the money he spent and the fact he and his 20,000 coaches had a full pre reason to get their shit together. Jones may well also prove to be a disaster but only time will tell on that one. How do we know he would not have got us to the play-offs - We were on a decent run, you and others spout about giving NJ time - was it fair to give a man just half a season to turn round what was a shambles of a club. It became clear by the end of January, however, that our only priority was to get to 50pts ASAP. Rowett brought in a handful of full-time players and it might have escaped your attention, but we couldn't get rid of the vast majority of our wonderful squad that finished above WBA(as you stated). NJ could have recalled those players who were responsible for finishing above WBA and disregarded Rowett's signings totally. The reality is that he used the players that Rowett brought in because they were an improvement on the shite we had in our squad. The other reality is that the clueless one was almost twice as effective with those players. Decent run ? Yeah we were unbeaten for 10 was it ? Mostly draws or the odd laboured 1 goal win against shit sides.And before Rowett was sacked we had picked up 1 point from 3 games with 0 goals scored. Twice as effective? Well he spunked 30 mil in attacking "talent " then sent out the team to play for draws against the Boltons and Readings of this world.Wonderful stuff Gary ! Rowett improved the squad ? Well no he didnt..he created more problems added to the ones he inherited.He signed players who clearly werent suited to the only system he was willing to play.Or shit like Cuco Martina. I could go on but everything has already been said.We are club well known for giving managers time..too much in some cases.The fact they got shut of GR after 8 months tells its own story. Again I will say NJ could go either way.At least he has a vision though and isnt stuck in the prehistoric age.Whether he can be a success here we dont yet know but I for one wont judge him just yet.
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Post by blackpoolred on May 31, 2019 22:45:42 GMT
How do we know he would not have got us to the play-offs - We were on a decent run, you and others spout about giving NJ time - was it fair to give a man just half a season to turn round what was a shambles of a club. It became clear by the end of January, however, that our only priority was to get to 50pts ASAP. Rowett brought in a handful of full-time players and it might have escaped your attention, but we couldn't get rid of the vast majority of our wonderful squad that finished above WBA(as you stated). NJ could have recalled those players who were responsible for finishing above WBA and disregarded Rowett's signings totally. The reality is that he used the players that Rowett brought in because they were an improvement on the shite we had in our squad. The other reality is that the clueless one was almost twice as effective with those players. Decent run ? Yeah we were unbeaten for 10 was it ? Mostly draws or the odd laboured 1 goal win against shit sides.And before Rowett was sacked we had picked up 1 point from 3 games with 0 goals scored. Twice as effective? Well he spunked 30 mil in attacking "talent " then sent out the team to play for draws against the Boltons and Readings of this world.Wonderful stuff Gary ! Rowett improved the squad ? Well no he didnt..he created more problems added to the ones he inherited.He signed players who clearly werent suited to the only system he was willing to play.Or shit like Cuco Martina. I could go on but everything has already been said.We are club well known for giving managers time..too much in some cases.The fact they got shut of GR after 8 months tells its own story. Again I will say NJ could go either way.At least he has a vision though and isnt stuck in the prehistoric age.Whether he can be a success here we dont yet know but I for one wont judge him just yet. NJ talks a fantastic vision I will give you that. It has been fascinating to see how his word play seems to have won everybody over. His performances were not only more laboured than Rowetts but up there with Pulis at times - remember the five 0-0 draws, we cant even call him binary man can we. As stated, he talks very passionately and seems to have a clear picture of what he wants and if his team play with half of the enthusiasm he has - then we may yet be in for a treat. I hope he throws the shackles off next season and has a bit more attacking intent and that we see a team enjoying their Nogger. If we look like we are showing any signs of improvement then I will be with him even if we in the bottom half(like I was with Rowett) and fending off the unrealistic amongst who are already saying top six finish or his head on a plate. However, if we start the season with no left-backs(like we ended it) or no back-up in any defensive positions, and continue to not create chances in front of goal, while conceeding too many at the other end - then I will struggle to get behind the man
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 31, 2019 22:51:54 GMT
Another tiresome straw man. Yeah I asked you to talk about the signings and it was at best ill-informed and one-eyed and in some cases just flat out wrong. The stuff on the left back, on McClean and on Martina in particular was eye watering nonsense. Don’t get me started on ‘the programme said there was a great atmosphere among the lads’, that looks like a calculated wind up. I don’t know if Jones is the right man or not. I hope he is, particularly because if he succeeds he’ll have essentially rebuilt us as a more exciting, energetic side than the moribund, joyless shit we’ve had to watch for years. You’ve constantly compared the job he’s done with the job Rowett’s done. The point is that Rowett was allowed to create HIS team with the biggest budget in the league. Jones hasn’t yet. The appointment is one that suggests we want to create something long term, not a quick fix with the latest Jurassic dullard, and I’m up for that. Results haven’t been good enough so far but I like that by the end of the season there was more energy about the team wedded to organisation, I like that he sought to build around Etebo, a conundrum too tough for the previous joker, I like that he’s prepared to play young players and I’m excited at the possibility he’ll look to create a Championship version of his free scoring Luton team. The OP was about how glorious the signings have been by NJ while slating Rowett - so my original reply was to that - which you took umbrage to. I asked for a reply without mentioning Rowett - you failed I like that NJ got the best out of Etebo and built around him too, but if he goes we could have Whelan back - the guy the moribund signed, not exactly youth either. Not sure the team was any better at the end of the season - we arguably got worse. I like the idea of a free-scoring version of Luton, but so far his team struggle to create chances let alone score goals and there was no evidence in the 2nd half of the season that we are anywhere near being like that, we still lack goals and not sure any of his signings so far point to an upcoming goal fest Again, for the hard of thinking - this isn’t his team yet. Once he’s got rid of the dross Rowett signed and has his own side in place, we’ll be able to judge better. Yes I ignored your Rowett request. What you’re essentially doing is asking the new Mayor of Chernobyl to justify himself without mentioning the meltdown that happened before he arrived. Not happening, chief. We didn’t ‘arguably get worse’ at the end of the season, our last two home games were enjoyable, spirited performances in open games against the promoted sides in which we earned creditable draws.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on May 31, 2019 22:54:19 GMT
Decent run ? Yeah we were unbeaten for 10 was it ? Mostly draws or the odd laboured 1 goal win against shit sides.And before Rowett was sacked we had picked up 1 point from 3 games with 0 goals scored. Twice as effective? Well he spunked 30 mil in attacking "talent " then sent out the team to play for draws against the Boltons and Readings of this world.Wonderful stuff Gary ! Rowett improved the squad ? Well no he didnt..he created more problems added to the ones he inherited.He signed players who clearly werent suited to the only system he was willing to play.Or shit like Cuco Martina. I could go on but everything has already been said.We are club well known for giving managers time..too much in some cases.The fact they got shut of GR after 8 months tells its own story. Again I will say NJ could go either way.At least he has a vision though and isnt stuck in the prehistoric age.Whether he can be a success here we dont yet know but I for one wont judge him just yet. NJ talks a fantastic vision I will give you that. It has been fascinating to see how his word play seems to have won everybody over. His performances were not only more laboured than Rowetts but up there with Pulis at times - remember the five 0-0 draws, we cant even call him binary man can we. As stated, he talks very passionately and seems to have a clear picture of what he wants and if his team play with half of the enthusiasm he has - then we may yet be in for a treat. I hope he throws the shackles off next season and has a bit more attacking intent and that we see a team enjoying their Nogger. If we look like we are showing any signs of improvement then I will be with him even if we in the bottom half(like I was with Rowett) and fending off the unrealistic amongst who are already saying top six finish or his head on a plate. However, if we start the season with no left-backs(like we ended it) or no back-up in any defensive positions, and continue to not create chances in front of goal, while conceeding too many at the other end - then I will struggle to get behind the man You won’t be with him at all. You’re a tedious iconoclast and even if he has us up there you’ll be talking him down.
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Post by JoeinOz on Jun 1, 2019 0:30:44 GMT
One thing Rowett''s time with us proves is unbeaten runs can be deceptive. Especially when you're going for promotion.
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Post by crapslinger on Jun 1, 2019 8:47:37 GMT
Any announcements ?
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Post by skelman on Jun 1, 2019 8:50:10 GMT
Seems all quiet on the western front still !
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