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Post by adi on Feb 10, 2019 9:49:35 GMT
The difference is people who have played the game and people who havenāt is booing backpasses. Woods passed the ball back to Butland with a man on his back earlier. What is he meant to do? Cruyff turn him. Probably get tackled and cost a goal. The problem is not passing back to the keeper, the problem is putting players in positions where it is their only option. Itās a bit condescending to suggest that unless youāve played you donāt understand.
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Post by Rick Grimes on Feb 10, 2019 10:12:49 GMT
There was at least one particular pass back to Butland from Woods that was booed by some yesterday but Woods didnāt have any other option.
There was no reason to boo it.
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Post by wearepremierleague on Feb 10, 2019 10:48:07 GMT
The difference is people who have played the game and people who havenāt is booing backpasses. Woods passed the ball back to Butland with a man on his back earlier. What is he meant to do? Cruyff turn him. Probably get tackled and cost a goal. The problem is not passing back to the keeper, the problem is putting players in positions where it is their only option. Itās a bit condescending to suggest that unless youāve played you donāt understand. Well since Iāve been going Stoke ive heard some complete shit shouted from the stands, and equally as much shit posted on here. There were people who slated Nzonzi. There were people who slated Arnautovic, and Shaqiri. Look at where these players are now? The Nzonzi thing was similar to the back pass situation. If we were on the break and he didnāt try the 70 yard glory ball which would 99% of the time not come off, people moaned. Now itās the only pass we have on, and people moan because our centre halves arenāt turning into Messi. Surely people who have played the game, understand it enough to know it isnāt as simple as forward, forward, forward, goal.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 11:05:05 GMT
Basically the players are scared and passing back is the easy option
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 10, 2019 11:42:44 GMT
Half the team canāt pass which is the crux of the problem- and a lot of our passing back ends with the ball going back to Butland, who guess what- has to hoof it. And .... 8 times out of 10 we lose possession! It's not a problem when we are under pressure and you have to pass back, it's when we are steaming forward with the opposition desperately scrambling back, only to see us stop and pass back, back, back to Butland, hoof it up to their midfield and watch them attack as it should be done. Great fun. And while we are at it, has anyone noticed how many times we lose possession from our own throw-ins?
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 10, 2019 11:43:20 GMT
There was at least one particular pass back to Butland from Woods that was booed by some yesterday but Woods didnāt have any other option. There was no reason to boo it. What about the other 472?
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 10, 2019 11:46:12 GMT
Itās a bit condescending to suggest that unless youāve played you donāt understand. Well since Iāve been going Stoke ive heard some complete shit shouted from the stands, and equally as much shit posted on here. There were people who slated Nzonzi. There were people who slated Arnautovic, and Shaqiri. Look at where these players are now? The Nzonzi thing was similar to the back pass situation. If we were on the break and he didnāt try the 70 yard glory ball which would 99% of the time not come off, people moaned. Now itās the only pass we have on, and people moan because our centre halves arenāt turning into Messi. Surely people who have played the game, understand it enough to know it isnāt as simple as forward, forward, forward, goal. Agreed, but.... in order to score, you have to shoot. In order to shoot, you have to be in a good position. In order to get into a good position, you have to go FORWARD. Surely people who have played the game can understand that?
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Post by dadofsam on Feb 10, 2019 12:00:35 GMT
Are the players shit or just lacking in all confidence who knows but one thing's for sure they just can not play a possession based passing game right now, that's why the back pass is happening so much, it's all they can do.
So why not go direct for a bit, get the ball behind the opposition defence and hassle the fuck out of them. Most of the defenders we are coming up against are not exactly mobile, they're more likely to be lumbering giants.
It's like "direct" has become a dirty word, but sometimes needs must.
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on Feb 10, 2019 12:01:38 GMT
has anyone ever considered that maybe our players aren't good enough to just play it forward and score?
football seems easy until you get given 20-25 players with different limitations.
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 10, 2019 12:56:23 GMT
has anyone ever considered that maybe our players aren't good enough to just play it forward and score? football seems easy until you get given 20-25 players with different limitations. So letās play it back and score?
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Post by kickbolukanbite on Feb 10, 2019 12:58:57 GMT
We'll be clapping the back passes when the results turn around.
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Post by StaffordPotter on Feb 10, 2019 12:58:58 GMT
I found the booing when the ref blew for half time more baffling.
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Post by tqstokie on Feb 10, 2019 13:05:33 GMT
I agree that to pass backwards is sometimes our only option but what is the point of passing backwards from the half way line for Butland to hoof it and have a 50-50 chance of retrieving the ball. We may as well hoof it from the half way line into their penalty box. I think it is never taking a chance to get it forward quickly is what people are complaining about.
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Post by nottsover60 on Feb 10, 2019 13:12:49 GMT
I thought Butlands kicking was better yesterday
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Post by ruts66 on Feb 10, 2019 13:15:35 GMT
Strikes me no manager is going to get anything like the usual honeymoon period so we'll keep hounding them out.
There's simply too much anger at the pathetic demise of the club over the past 3yrs or so, and, too little common sense to give any new bugger a chance...
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Post by johno1112 on Feb 10, 2019 13:59:52 GMT
There is a right bellend in block 28 who takes great delight pointing out every backward/sideways/miss directcted pass. It is like he enjoys moaning, really wish we could turn a corner, bet he will be miserable with nothing to moan about, the sad old tool...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 14:43:27 GMT
Clucas took a throw in, probably 20yds inside WBAs half and instead of throwing it towards their penalty area threw it back into our half and I think that ended up back with Butland. It makes my blood boil, it's like some of them are programmed to pass backwards first and think second
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Post by RT-SCFC on Feb 10, 2019 15:35:18 GMT
Clucas took a throw in, probably 20yds inside WBAs half and instead of throwing it towards their penalty area threw it back into our half and I think that ended up back with Butland. It makes my blood boil, it's like some of them are programmed to pass backwards first and think second It is annoying when we go from being 20 yards inside there half and then end up going back to Butland but thats not my point, booing when we do that or make any sort of mistakeisnāt in any way supportive and will force the players to play within themselves. In an ideal world when we have to go back from a being inside there half its because we are switching the play to brake the opponent down but we obviously arenāt able to switch the play like that just yet.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 15:46:57 GMT
It is mental. People go on and on about players having no confidence and being scared, then boo everything they do.
Backwards passes are sometimes needed and I would rather our players feel comfortable enough on the ball to pass wherever they want than just feel they have to hoof it into the box every time.
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Post by supacoopa101 on Feb 10, 2019 15:51:59 GMT
If it was going backwards because there was nothing else on then fine. However, time & time again, there are opportunities to play a more adventurous pass to try and make some progress up the field. Yet we play it backwards, which results in the defenders passing around between themselves, then back to the keeper who hoofs it aimlessly and we lose possession. I think thats why Charlie Adam looks like Modric when he played, as he isnāt frightened to play a forward positive pass. Sadly, serveral of the backwards passes that were jeered yesterday were when players were in positions with no other option. Itās clear that some of our fans simply donāt understand football as a game. If it was as plain and simple as passing forward at every opportunity, weād all be playing football. Sometimes you need to go backwards to go forwards again, itās a simple concept, keeping possession of the football increases your chances of winning. The opposition cannot score whilst you have the ball. Our fans this season have played a huge part in our position. People forget that footballers arenāt robots, regardless how much they are paid there isnāt a magic switch to turn off your feelings. This is nothing to do with them being āsnowflakesā as people have replied in the past, this is simply because booing is counterproductive. It creates a vicious circle. A backwards pass gets booād, the next time that player gets the ball they try a riskier forward pass and lose the ball, they boo more, then the next time they play a safer pass, so they boo again. Iāve said it before and I will say it again. I can take relegation to non-league football but the fans with pre-historic ideations that clearly know fuck all about football are killing this club. The atmosphere at home matches is absolutely laughable and embarrassing almost to the point where I would rather watch it on TV. Iād never stop going because of a poor run of results but sitting amongst a bunch of fuckwits that boo every minor misplaced pass and every recycle of the ball is painful. Bunch of crayon eating, window licking bell ends. Absolutely fucking this! No words to describe how much I agree with this post. Maybe because it is true
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Post by stokeramblers on Feb 10, 2019 15:54:15 GMT
āGerrit dun Mayā
āGerrit forwards Jonesā
We donāt do trifling details, nuances and intricacies round here do we...
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Post by thehoof on Feb 10, 2019 16:19:00 GMT
I am really perplexed why these people who understand the game and are quick to criticise others āwho have clearly not played the gameā are not playing or managing a team themselves? Possession football is fine when it is played with purpose, but as someone who played at Southern League standard, I would really appreciate one of our possession Einsteinās telling me what the purpose of Woods retreating from the half way line to receive the ball from BMI, only to immediately knock it back to BMI is? Has it drawn anyone out of position? The teams who are good at possession and pass the ball backwards (Barca, Man C even Liverpool recently ) are usually playing a high line and pressing the opposition- as the space is compressed the ball will be recycled along the back 4 but still within 40 to 50 yards of the opposition goal. Stoke start the recycling of the ball some 10 to 15 yards outside of our own box, and usually need 2 or 3 touches to control the ball, hence inviting pressure onto a back line that is clearly struggling. For those of us who know nothing about football and have never played, a bloke by the name of Guardiola said ā it is hard for the opposition to score if you have possession of the ball in the opposition halfā.
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 10, 2019 18:20:50 GMT
Sadly, serveral of the backwards passes that were jeered yesterday were when players were in positions with no other option. Itās clear that some of our fans simply donāt understand football as a game. If it was as plain and simple as passing forward at every opportunity, weād all be playing football. Sometimes you need to go backwards to go forwards again, itās a simple concept, keeping possession of the football increases your chances of winning. The opposition cannot score whilst you have the ball. Our fans this season have played a huge part in our position. People forget that footballers arenāt robots, regardless how much they are paid there isnāt a magic switch to turn off your feelings. This is nothing to do with them being āsnowflakesā as people have replied in the past, this is simply because booing is counterproductive. It creates a vicious circle. A backwards pass gets booād, the next time that player gets the ball they try a riskier forward pass and lose the ball, they boo more, then the next time they play a safer pass, so they boo again. Iāve said it before and I will say it again. I can take relegation to non-league football but the fans with pre-historic ideations that clearly know fuck all about football are killing this club. The atmosphere at home matches is absolutely laughable and embarrassing almost to the point where I would rather watch it on TV. Iād never stop going because of a poor run of results but sitting amongst a bunch of fuckwits that boo every minor misplaced pass and every recycle of the ball is painful. Bunch of crayon eating, window licking bell ends. Absolutely fucking this! No words to describe how much I agree with this post. Maybe because it is true While I agree that no Stoke fan should ever boo Stoke players, can someone please explain how the back pass that lead to the free kick that lead to their goal was a good move?
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Post by Block 22 on Feb 10, 2019 18:48:48 GMT
Absolutely fucking this! No words to describe how much I agree with this post. Maybe because it is true While I agree that no Stoke fan should ever boo Stoke players, can someone please explain how the back pass that lead to the free kick that lead to their goal was a good move? So now weāre going back 3 passages of play to identify the cause of the goal? What about the fact that Hegazi, the biggest and slowest lump in their side was allowed to run, unchallenged without a stoke player within ten yards and head the ball back across goal? If youāre blaming the free kick for the result of that goal and totally ignoring the worse than school boy set piece defending then you really are clutching at straws to a new level.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 22:55:27 GMT
I've just listened to the manager's after match interview where his comment on the booing is the fans have to be patient or tell him they want to see us go direct and he'll get 2 giants in. Someone needs to tell him this is a hangover from the previous 3 years of dire slow pass the buck football we've had to endure and in particular Rowett's last couple of months and not a reaction to his style of football in particular. We don't need him getting all touchy on us...look what happened to the last bloke who did that
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 23:01:43 GMT
I've just listened to the manager's after match interview where his comment on the booing is the fans have to be patient or tell him they want to see us go direct and he'll get 2 giants in. Someone needs to tell him this is a hangover from the previous 3 years of dire slow pass the buck football we've had to endure and in particular Rowett's last couple of months and not a reaction to his style of football in particular. We don't need him getting all touchy on us...look what happened to the last bloke who did that I donāt think he was I think he was just trying to explain what heās doing. The man looks like heās not slept for a month. Heās not verging in doing a Rowett in a post match interview yet. I do think someone should tell him though so he understands. Alternatively we could stop booing every back pass š at some point weāve got to let the past go and move on.
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Post by thehoof on Feb 10, 2019 23:11:12 GMT
While I agree that no Stoke fan should ever boo Stoke players, can someone please explain how the back pass that lead to the free kick that lead to their goal was a good move? So now weāre going back 3 passages of play to identify the cause of the goal? What about the fact that Hegazi, the biggest and slowest lump in their side was allowed to run, unchallenged without a stoke player within ten yards and head the ball back across goal? If youāre blaming the free kick for the result of that goal and totally ignoring the worse than school boy set piece defending then you really are clutching at straws to a new level. The goal came from a free kick that resulted from a misplaced back pass and lack of control from the recipient of the unnecessary back pass. You are right about the shitty defending thereafter, but the cause of the entire subsequent passage of play was the UNNECESSARY backpass. There was no pressure at the time of the backpass, but I know nothing about football and havenāt played the game.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2019 23:15:43 GMT
So now weāre going back 3 passages of play to identify the cause of the goal? What about the fact that Hegazi, the biggest and slowest lump in their side was allowed to run, unchallenged without a stoke player within ten yards and head the ball back across goal? If youāre blaming the free kick for the result of that goal and totally ignoring the worse than school boy set piece defending then you really are clutching at straws to a new level. The goal came from a free kick that resulted from a misplaced back pass and lack of control from the recipient of the unnecessary back pass. You are right about the shitty defending thereafter, but the cause of the entire subsequent passage of play was the UNNECESSARY backpass. There was no pressure at the time of the backpass, but I know nothing about football and havenāt played the game. Did it? Was it not Woods kicking it only 2 yards in front of himself to a West Brom player then Joe (?) having to make a challenge he shouldnāt have made? I thought it was down to Woods not clearing the ball properly again for the millionth time this season?
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Post by thehoof on Feb 10, 2019 23:21:17 GMT
I've just listened to the manager's after match interview where his comment on the booing is the fans have to be patient or tell him they want to see us go direct and he'll get 2 giants in. Someone needs to tell him this is a hangover from the previous 3 years of dire slow pass the buck football we've had to endure and in particular Rowett's last couple of months and not a reaction to his style of football in particular. We don't need him getting all touchy on us...look what happened to the last bloke who did that I donāt think he was I think he was just trying to explain what heās doing. The man looks like heās not slept for a month. Heās not verging in doing a Rowett in a post match interview yet. I do think someone should tell him though so he understands. Alternatively we could stop booing every back pass š at some point weāve got to let the past go and move on. You may have a better view than mine - where I was siting I thought Woods had tried a step over and actually knocked it backwards- either way as Rosenoir pointed out in the highlights package we have 3 midfielders occupying 10 yards of space and there is no way that the ball can be moved forward- if we had better ball players in our defenders I would have a bit more sympathy with the views of Phil or Block 22 but any pass to our back 4 is an invitation to disaster.
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Post by thehoof on Feb 10, 2019 23:23:08 GMT
Sorry e-Stoke, copied the wrong post! I think you know which one I am referring to.
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