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Post by noustie on Jan 12, 2019 21:29:00 GMT
To put that performance for a new manager is fucking embarrassing. Maybe it was naïve changing formation but the way they played you'd have thought he asked them to put their boots on their hands or something. He needs to rip out that dressing room because the culture is cancerous - they still seem under the misnomer of being Premier League. To turn that out for a guy who spoke so well and obviously just wants the same opportunity they spunked up a wall last season says it all. I don't think there was a lack of effort there- they're just absolute shite. I don't think there was a lack of effort about running around individually but they didn't really look that bothered about trying to function as a cohesive unit and they still seem to think they're a lot better than they are.
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Post by prudhoesnose on Jan 12, 2019 21:39:40 GMT
I don’t think this squad has any hunger to win. And mentally they are shot; they expect to lose. NJ has a project on his hands that’s for sure.
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Post by citynickscfc on Jan 12, 2019 22:38:54 GMT
I don’t think this squad has any hunger to win. And mentally they are shot; they expect to lose. NJ has a project on his hands that’s for sure. The majority of them would be finished if we got promoted, at least here in the hinterlands they have it easy on big money. Go figure.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2019 22:41:55 GMT
Complete lack of desire from the team, we need players on the up with a hunger to better themselves, not has beens on the way down.....
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Post by gingerninja on Jan 12, 2019 23:16:32 GMT
I am sure there are a great number of players at the lower levels who could come here and make an impact for a fraction of the cost of some of our misfits.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 9:16:41 GMT
Bauer you'd hope would shine in a system where full-backs get forward; I think there may come a day when we're so dominant that fullbacks can concentrate on being creative and providing attacking options, and they can march forward safe in the knowledge that defenders and midfield anchors will cover for them. But that's not gonna happen for many years, and Bauer will be retired then. For sure he already looks good rushing forward with or without the ball, however when it comes to defensive duties he just doesn't know about them. So either he will have to be moved on, and he's the one SCFC player who probably will have takers, or Jones will have to be on his case every day to teach basic defensive duties. I think he might have other, more pressing tasks on his hands. So I'd sell Bauer.
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Post by wagsastokie on Jan 13, 2019 9:28:36 GMT
I'd be amazed if any Prem club took a punt on him. Maybe if they can get him for £3-4m as a squad player. But why would any Prem club buy a player who looks out of his depth against Brentford (and not just Brentford!). He was absolutely awful today. Because they're stupid and lazy and would rather make decisions based on reputations and highlights, rather than due diligence. Time is running out for us of course though. Now what team would be stupid enough to run a transfer policy like that
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Post by fishlovesoatcakes on Jan 13, 2019 9:44:31 GMT
Nobody is begging you to stay with your negative attitude. Keep clapping bud. You'll get your rewards I'm sure. I don't think anyone is 'clapping' do you? Negativity breeds negativity. Jones has been in charge for 3 days! I've said on another thread that the players have had 4 different managers, different tactics, different expectations and a crowd that has quite frankly been poor. Combine all of these and you have your answer. Their confidence must be rock bottom. It is now that our club needs the fans to get on board and accept that they are trying to make wholesale changes to improve us. We do need a few players in to improve us and Jones will already have an idea of where the additions are needed. If fans expect immediate improvements, there's plenty of seat available at the Etihad. I'm actually quite excited that we've got Jones in charge. He oozes positivity and that will eventually trickle down to the playing staff. If you've ever managed people, this should come as no surprise.
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Post by magwitch on Jan 13, 2019 10:06:27 GMT
Bauer you'd hope would shine in a system where full-backs get forward; I think there may come a day when we're so dominant that fullbacks can concentrate on being creative and providing attacking options, and they can march forward safe in the knowledge that defenders and midfield anchors will cover for them. But that's not gonna happen for many years, and Bauer will be retired then. For sure he already looks good rushing forward with or without the ball, however when it comes to defensive duties he just doesn't know about them. So either he will have to be moved on, and he's the one SCFC player who probably will have takers, or Jones will have to be on his case every day to teach basic defensive duties. I think he might have other, more pressing tasks on his hands. So I'd sell Bauer. I am pleased that the board has appointed a young up and coming manager like Nathan Jones, who has the ability to sort out the current mess that is Stoke City, always assuming he has the full support of the board and if fully backed by the fan base. Gary Rowett unfortunately was undermined by the fanbase. but I do not believe he was a bad appointment, and would have succeeded in time given the removal of the slackers abd parasites. In short the complete overhail promised by Peter Coates and never carried out.
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Post by PotteringThrough on Jan 13, 2019 10:10:54 GMT
I think there may come a day when we're so dominant that fullbacks can concentrate on being creative and providing attacking options, and they can march forward safe in the knowledge that defenders and midfield anchors will cover for them. But that's not gonna happen for many years, and Bauer will be retired then. For sure he already looks good rushing forward with or without the ball, however when it comes to defensive duties he just doesn't know about them. So either he will have to be moved on, and he's the one SCFC player who probably will have takers, or Jones will have to be on his case every day to teach basic defensive duties. I think he might have other, more pressing tasks on his hands. So I'd sell Bauer. I am pleased that the board has appointed a young up and coming manager like Nathan Jones, who has the ability to sort out the current mess that is Stoke City, always assuming he has the full support of the board and if fully backed by the fan base. Gary Rowett unfortunately was undermined by the fanbase. but I do not believe he was a bad appointment, and would have succeeded in time given the removal of the slackers abd parasites. In short the complete overhail promised by Peter Coates and never carried out. Gary Rowett was not undermined by the fan base. The fan base were the only ones listening to him at the end.
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Post by magwitch on Jan 13, 2019 10:44:24 GMT
I am pleased that the board has appointed a young up and coming manager like Nathan Jones, who has the ability to sort out the current mess that is Stoke City, always assuming he has the full support of the board and if fully backed by the fan base. Gary Rowett unfortunately was undermined by the fanbase. but I do not believe he was a bad appointment, and would have succeeded in time given the removal of the slackers abd parasites. In short the complete overhail promised by Peter Coates and never carried out. Gary Rowett was not undermined by the fan base. The fan base were the only ones listening to him at the end. Have you not read his comments about dreadful people, and his relief at being fired?
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 13, 2019 10:55:37 GMT
I think there may come a day when we're so dominant that fullbacks can concentrate on being creative and providing attacking options, and they can march forward safe in the knowledge that defenders and midfield anchors will cover for them. But that's not gonna happen for many years, and Bauer will be retired then. For sure he already looks good rushing forward with or without the ball, however when it comes to defensive duties he just doesn't know about them. So either he will have to be moved on, and he's the one SCFC player who probably will have takers, or Jones will have to be on his case every day to teach basic defensive duties. I think he might have other, more pressing tasks on his hands. So I'd sell Bauer. I am pleased that the board has appointed a young up and coming manager like Nathan Jones, who has the ability to sort out the current mess that is Stoke City, always assuming he has the full support of the board and if fully backed by the fan base. Gary Rowett unfortunately was undermined by the fanbase. but I do not believe he was a bad appointment, and would have succeeded in time given the removal of the slackers abd parasites. In short the complete overhail promised by Peter Coates and never carried out. Rowett signed 9 players, that is an overhaul. None of them have been good. Ince has talent but overall has been average. All the rest...shit. Rowett has left major problems now, the squad is a joke. Pound for pound, relative to outlays, surely the worst in the country The disparity between our wages and budget and most other teams is like celtic v the rest of the spl, can you imagine them struggling like we are? Monumental fuck ups in recruitment. And rowett has the worst record in recruitment, worse than any other stoke manager I can remember. He should be apologising for the destruction he's reaped upon this club.
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Post by PotteringThrough on Jan 13, 2019 10:56:04 GMT
Gary Rowett was not undermined by the fan base. The fan base were the only ones listening to him at the end. Have you not read his comments about dreadful people, and his relief at being fired? The made up quote from a fake Twitter account? Yes, I saw that.
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Post by ursemboys on Jan 13, 2019 10:58:55 GMT
Gary Rowett was not undermined by the fan base. The fan base were the only ones listening to him at the end. Have you not read his comments about dreadful people, and his relief at being fired? Do You really believe the comments here made by him ,it was a wind up
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 11:11:39 GMT
I've got no hope in these players at all. I hope Jones sorts it out, but it is going to take time. I virtually gave up when we signed McClean (a journeyman, if ever there was one). This squad is rubbish ( for once, I won't use my usual term). It's soul destroying at the moment!
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 11:14:17 GMT
Keep clapping bud. You'll get your rewards I'm sure. I don't think anyone is 'clapping' do you? Negativity breeds negativity. Jones has been in charge for 3 days! I've said on another thread that the players have had 4 different managers, different tactics, different expectations and a crowd that has quite frankly been poor. Combine all of these and you have your answer. Their confidence must be rock bottom. It is now that our club needs the fans to get on board and accept that they are trying to make wholesale changes to improve us. We do need a few players in to improve us and Jones will already have an idea of where the additions are needed. If fans expect immediate improvements, there's plenty of seat available at the Etihad. I'm actually quite excited that we've got Jones in charge. He oozes positivity and that will eventually trickle down to the playing staff. If you've ever managed people, this should come as no surprise. I think lots of people are clutching at straws for sure. If Jones displays the strength of personality to make the necessary changes on and off the pitch, he'll get all the support he needs. If he doesn't and becomes another human shield to hide the failings of others any goodwill will disappear very quickly. Yesterday was arguably our worst display of the season to date. It was absolutely rancid and it doesn't bode well does it? These players are complete and utter shit houses and we need to get rid of every one of them as quickly as possible.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 11:15:33 GMT
Gary Rowett was not undermined by the fan base. The fan base were the only ones listening to him at the end. Have you not read his comments about dreadful people, and his relief at being fired? Where are these comments?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 11:23:44 GMT
I don't think anyone is 'clapping' do you? Negativity breeds negativity. Jones has been in charge for 3 days! I've said on another thread that the players have had 4 different managers, different tactics, different expectations and a crowd that has quite frankly been poor. Combine all of these and you have your answer. Their confidence must be rock bottom. It is now that our club needs the fans to get on board and accept that they are trying to make wholesale changes to improve us. We do need a few players in to improve us and Jones will already have an idea of where the additions are needed. If fans expect immediate improvements, there's plenty of seat available at the Etihad. I'm actually quite excited that we've got Jones in charge. He oozes positivity and that will eventually trickle down to the playing staff. If you've ever managed people, this should come as no surprise. I think lots of people are clutching at straws for sure. If Jones displays the strength of personality to make the necessary changes on and off the pitch, he'll get all the support he needs. If he doesn't and becomes another human shield to hide the failings of others any goodwill will disappear very quickly. Yesterday was arguably our worst display of the season to date. It was absolutely rancid and it doesn't bode well does it? These players are complete and utter shit houses and we need to get rid of every one of them as quickly as possible. Yesterday showed that regardless who the manager is, a lot more money needs spending on top of the ludicrous amount already spent. Be it Nathan Jones or Sam Allardyce. A lot of fans have been clutching at a lot of straws for a long time, going back to the Hughes era.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jan 13, 2019 11:23:51 GMT
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 12:05:52 GMT
A bit of leadership from who though?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 12:06:59 GMT
I think lots of people are clutching at straws for sure. If Jones displays the strength of personality to make the necessary changes on and off the pitch, he'll get all the support he needs. If he doesn't and becomes another human shield to hide the failings of others any goodwill will disappear very quickly. Yesterday was arguably our worst display of the season to date. It was absolutely rancid and it doesn't bode well does it? These players are complete and utter shit houses and we need to get rid of every one of them as quickly as possible. Yesterday showed that regardless who the manager is, a lot more money needs spending on top of the ludicrous amount already spent. Be it Nathan Jones or Sam Allardyce. A lot of fans have been clutching at a lot of straws for a long time, going back to the Hughes era. We cant keep throwing money at it though.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Jan 13, 2019 12:07:17 GMT
A bit of leadership from who though? Not sure if he’s on about the team or upstairs in the hierarchy🤔
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Post by lordb on Jan 13, 2019 12:08:50 GMT
A bit of leadership from who though? The manager first and foremost. Then 'leaders' in the dressing room. For me I think that young quality quick centre back we all know we need would make the world of difference. Once the fullbacks trust the centre back so then the whole thing will improve.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 12:10:32 GMT
Yesterday showed that regardless who the manager is, a lot more money needs spending on top of the ludicrous amount already spent. Be it Nathan Jones or Sam Allardyce. A lot of fans have been clutching at a lot of straws for a long time, going back to the Hughes era. We cant keep throwing money at it though. If what you've already spent is crap then you have no choice. You just have to spend it better. You yourself last night said you wouldn't mind selling all bar Butland. What are you replacing them with, freebies? Major surgery is needed from top to bottom and that costs. It can't all be done at once and it is a major project that will span 3 seasons. I predicted 2 in the summer and was laughed at. Seems I was too positive...
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 12:13:44 GMT
We cant keep throwing money at it though. If what you've already spent is crap then you have no choice. You just have to spend it better. You yourself last night said you wouldn't mind selling all bar Butland. What are you replacing them with, freebies? Major surgery is needed from top to bottom and that costs. It can't all be done at once and it is a major project that will span 3 seasons. I predicted 2 in the summer and was laughed at. Seems I was too positive... Buying with money generated from sales is completely different to throwing yet more money at it with next to no one going out the other way.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 13, 2019 12:14:48 GMT
A bit of leadership from who though? The manager first and foremost. Then 'leaders' in the dressing room. For me I think that young quality quick centre back we all know we need would make the world of difference. Once the fullbacks trust the centre back so then the whole thing will improve. And you think the centre halves can trust the full backs or the shower of shit midfield in front of them?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2019 12:15:10 GMT
If what you've already spent is crap then you have no choice. You just have to spend it better. You yourself last night said you wouldn't mind selling all bar Butland. What are you replacing them with, freebies? Major surgery is needed from top to bottom and that costs. It can't all be done at once and it is a major project that will span 3 seasons. I predicted 2 in the summer and was laughed at. Seems I was too positive... Buying with money generated from sales is completely different to throwing yet more money at it with next to no one going out the other way. Sorry Dave, we're on the same page with that one. I agree and think we will sell to buy. It will cost though as we will lose money on every signing we've made bar Butland and Allen.
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Post by Billy the kid on Jan 13, 2019 12:20:05 GMT
3 managers in 12 months, and they all can't get a tune out of this shower of shit. If Rowett hadn't have been a total shit house prick I am sure he would have still been here. A total mismanagement of requirement in the summer left us with a defence that can't defend a midfield that simply doesn't work (in any combination or personnel) and a forward line that see so little of the ball they are possibly caught cold when they do get the ball. Make no mistakes this isn't a manager problem this is a poison in the club, Rowett was removed because of his lack of respect for the fans and players nothing else. NJ looks very much like he has just won a golden ticket, I'm not sure of his character behind closed doors but I'm sure as shit he doesn't have the authority when it comes to the more senior players in this puss poor squad.
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 13, 2019 12:42:24 GMT
The thing to remember is this summer if not sooner we will move out several players exhausting the wage budget.
OUT Contracts expire 2019 Adam Crouch Fletcher Affellay
That will reduce wage costs by around 6-7 million a year I'll bet? Assuming they are on 40-50k a week
Also out; Expired loans Martina Williams Probably reduce the wage bill by another 4 million plus because that would be the cost of their wages which I am assuming we are paying this season.
SELL this summer if we can (all sellable assets who are under performing or hefty contracts expiring soon so will probably take lesser pay elsewhere for a 2-3 year deal): Allen Butland Afobe Woods Mcclean Bojan Pieters Bauer Clucas Etebo Diouf Bruno
This list above, I don't see why we wouldn't be able to sell most of that.
I don't have a particular problem with most of that,I just think we need to get as many players out as possible and start again. Most of them wouldn't fit in to jones style of play, and I bet we could get in 40-50 million for that lot.
Otherwise, we have a group of players that I don't think are sellable and still have at least a couple of years to run...Wimmer, imbula, berahino and sadly, Shawcross. The point here has to be to try and loan those out again.
I think there is plenty of scope for Jones to overhaul everything, give him the time as we are in a place, after three disastrous summer window, where relative to money spent this is one of the worst squads in the history of the club.
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Jan 13, 2019 12:45:21 GMT
3 managers in 12 months, and they all can't get a tune out of this shower of shit. If Rowett hadn't have been a total shit house prick I am sure he would have still been here. A total mismanagement of requirement in the summer left us with a defence that can't defend a midfield that simply doesn't work (in any combination or personnel) and a forward line that see so little of the ball they are possibly caught cold when they do get the ball. Make no mistakes this isn't a manager problem this is a poison in the club, Rowett was removed because of his lack of respect for the fans and players nothing else. NJ looks very much like he has just won a golden ticket, I'm not sure of his character behind closed doors but I'm sure as shit he doesn't have the authority when it comes to the more senior players in this puss poor squad. In one transfer window Rowett has caused probably most of the problems we have in the current squad. He's done that in one window mate. Absolute disaster of a manager
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