sting
Youth Player
Posts: 354
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ID Cards
Dec 5, 2018 14:41:48 GMT
via mobile
Post by sting on Dec 5, 2018 14:41:48 GMT
The problem hasn’t gone away. The ID cards merely managed it. They removed 300 troublemakers from getting tickets and it worked, whatever anyone thinks of it. Promotion to the PL was always predicted to disengage further. Harder to get tickets, less opportunity. Relegation sadly provided the platform for it to return. Preston and Forest hinted at a growing problem. Last night was predictable given the complacency of SCFC.
The club should have restricted ticket sales. Insisted on reserved seating. Insisted on a sterile area. All basics. Whoever liaised with Vale did a crap job. If anyone actually bothered.
Nobody wants to see the cards back but the club has to wake up and proactively manage this.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2018 14:55:13 GMT
Oh fuck off with your ID cards
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 5, 2018 15:08:32 GMT
Overreaction??? If aimed at me; 1. I'm not asking for the return of the ID cards. 2. If you believe the behaviour of some last night is OK, fair enough. Personally I don't 3. If you believe such behaviour doesn't tarnish the name of the Club, Its supporters or The City itself. OK, fair enough. Personally I do 4. If you believe the local Police at away grounds won't (or don't) consider the supporters reputation and Police it differently. OK, fair enough. Personally I do Hope the above clarifies my stance You need to change your first post then Please explain and clarify.
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 5, 2018 15:12:32 GMT
I did not!!! suggest the return of the ID card system. I feel empathy for all the hard work by a few to get rid of the system on the hope that we had turned the corner. To summarise, its a bit of a pointless fucking thread. I apologise for any inconvenience. I'll seek your approval in future
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 5, 2018 15:14:38 GMT
Oh fuck off with your ID cards Clyde I don't think anyone is suggesting a return to the ID system unless I've missed something on other posts. It would certainly be a retrograde step in my view
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ID Cards
Dec 5, 2018 15:24:44 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2018 15:24:44 GMT
Oh fuck off with your ID cards Clyde I don't think anyone is suggesting a return to the ID system unless I've missed something on other posts.  It would certainly be a retrograde step in my view Sorry mate that may have come across if I was purposely pointing that at you. It wasn’t... it was my feeling towards them in general. For me ID cards killed out away crowds, if they came back I’d be gone
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Post by skemstokie on Dec 5, 2018 15:32:08 GMT
As disappointing as last night was, how many games involving Stoke have seen that much disorder since the ID cards were scrapped? One is more than enough,time for these morons to be named and shamed (presuming they have shame in their D.N.A.) and banned from ALL football grounds for life.
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Post by flea79 on Dec 5, 2018 16:29:47 GMT
As disappointing as last night was, how many games involving Stoke have seen that much disorder since the ID cards were scrapped? One is more than enough,time for these morons to be named and shamed (presuming they have shame in their D.N.A.) and banned from ALL football grounds for life. from where i was stood a lot of older lads were causing a ruck but a lot of younger kids were looking to make a name for themselves or have a story to tell at school what the kids did was shameful and stupid but they are young they saw some of the older guys and copied, yes they should be punished but a life ban for them seems draconian, some restorative justice would be appropriate, whether that be spending some time putting right the mess they made or something of that nature, some might learn a lesson and in future not get involved, obviously some wont as for the older ones if they are identified well lets face it they will get a small fine and a ticking off or a community resolution, its water of a ducks back! FBO's are getting harder for courts to impose and enforce due to the very restrictive nature of them interestingly i was reading a few weeks back that any fan identified as a "risk" fan can be stopped from travelling and have passports removed etc, this can be for something as small as being filmed leaving a pub with known troublemakers, so the long and short is that some of us who were just nearby the aggro last night might now be noted as risk supporters....
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Post by skemstokie on Dec 5, 2018 16:38:11 GMT
One is more than enough,time for these morons to be named and shamed (presuming they have shame in their D.N.A.) and banned from ALL football grounds for life. from where i was stood a lot of older lads were causing a ruck but a lot of younger kids were looking to make a name for themselves or have a story to tell at school what the kids did was shameful and stupid but they are young they saw some of the older guys and copied, yes they should be punished but a life ban for them seems draconian, some restorative justice would be appropriate, whether that be spending some time putting right the mess they made or something of that nature, some might learn a lesson and in future not get involved, obviously some wont as for the older ones if they are identified well lets face it they will get a small fine and a ticking off or a community resolution, its water of a ducks back! FBO's are getting harder for courts to impose and enforce due to the very restrictive nature of them interestingly i was reading a few weeks back that any fan identified as a "risk" fan can be stopped from travelling and have passports removed etc, this can be for something as small as being filmed leaving a pub with known troublemakers, so the long and short is that some of us who were just nearby the aggro last night might now be noted as risk supporters.... With face recognition technology now available i think FBO`s should now be easier to inforce ? and as you say the young morons copied the older morons so adopt a tactic of being harsh on the older element and restorative justice for the younger elements.
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Post by northstaffycher on Dec 5, 2018 17:02:48 GMT
Jeez, get it into proportion. More damage done at a girl guide jamboree. Hysterics. I for one love it when fans use flares and smoke bombs, gives the game a bit of atmosphere instead of the usual sterile stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2018 17:40:21 GMT
I found mine the other day. Is it still valid? Yes, if you have it with you when you meet Guernsey Dave he will buy you a free pint! True Smug IDiocy is still alive and kicking Bottyprober ! GD
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 5, 2018 20:05:58 GMT
Jeez, get it into proportion. More damage done at a girl guide jamboree. Hysterics. I for one love it when fans use flares and smoke bombs, gives the game a bit of atmosphere instead of the usual sterile stuff. Planet Zog is calling. Please apply for admission
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ID Cards
Dec 5, 2018 23:10:34 GMT
via mobile
Post by boothenboys1863 on Dec 5, 2018 23:10:34 GMT
I can almost guarantee this kind of trouble wont happen for a long time. Knobheads attend every match, this was different because the 'stewarding' / 'policing' was a total shambles. They let full capacity in the away end unreserved! If there was any organisation (like at every other normal game up and down the country, where fans are removed from stairways, told to sit down and healthy and safety procedures are adhered to) then i'd suggest alot of last nights mither in the away end would have been avoided. The police chose to simply stand between Vale & Stoke and they left the fans to there own devices, unfortunately, after alcohol and groups of lads get together, banter spills over and what happened, happened. What happened was a total disgrace, people smashing up toilets and what not, shocking. But given proper policing, it simply would not have had chance to have happened, and if it did, then the police could have simply removed the main culprits. Has it happened at any away day in the past 10-15-20 years?????? No! Why they didn't put the vale in the bycars is a mystery to all. It would have prevented a lot of the issues in the ground and allowed the police to man the away end properly to prevent or restrict the vandalism. One thing I did notice last night was how few people I recognised from the usual away games, maybe half a dozen at best. Said the same myself to my mate.. you usually recognise at least 50% of people at an away game if you go plenty of them but last night I hardly saw anyone I recognise
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Post by Gods on Dec 5, 2018 23:53:23 GMT
I just watched the highlights on Youtube.
Really bad planning, given the ground was as empty as the Marie Celeste, that the 2 sets of fans were spitting distance from one another in that corner of the ground.
Our fatal mistake was the brainless vandalism of the toilets. No valour only shame in that.
Apart from that it looked like 6 of one half a dozen of the other posturing in that corner.
I suppose if you are looking for a winner for the evening 'police overtime' just ahead of xmas would take the prize.
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Post by stokemark on Dec 6, 2018 2:55:35 GMT
At Reading the average age of a Stoke fan was around 74 and I have seen a more threatening atmosphere at a Darby and Joan dominoes night
This match was the exception not the rule ffs
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Post by owdestokie2 on Dec 6, 2018 8:17:37 GMT
At Reading the average age of a Stoke fan was around 74 and I have seen a more threatening atmosphere at a Darby and Joan dominoes night This match was the exception not the rule ffs “One” of the problems is “Shit Sticks” and it will affect the manner in which Stoke supporters are Policed at other grounds. Reputations are easily damaged, once damaged it’s a long slog to regain confidence
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Post by stantheman on Dec 6, 2018 8:19:16 GMT
I can almost guarantee this kind of trouble wont happen for a long time. Knobheads attend every match, this was different because the 'stewarding' / 'policing' was a total shambles. They let full capacity in the away end unreserved! If there was any organisation (like at every other normal game up and down the country, where fans are removed from stairways, told to sit down and healthy and safety procedures are adhered to) then i'd suggest alot of last nights mither in the away end would have been avoided. The police chose to simply stand between Vale & Stoke and they left the fans to there own devices, unfortunately, after alcohol and groups of lads get together, banter spills over and what happened, happened. What happened was a total disgrace, people smashing up toilets and what not, shocking. But given proper policing, it simply would not have had chance to have happened, and if it did, then the police could have simply removed the main culprits. Has it happened at any away day in the past 10-15-20 years?????? No! Either the Police or Vale thought it was advisable to put netting on the Railway Paddock seats in the corner. So why did they stand back and watch Vale fans rip it off to get closer to us? The entire railway stand should have been empty and Vale shift in the other end it was Complete Madness to allow both sets of supporters to be so close to each other. I also still can't believe that some genius thought it was a good idea to sell alcohol to Stoke supporters, some of whom had been on the piss or afternoon. Talk about adding fuel to the fire
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Post by flea79 on Dec 6, 2018 9:14:25 GMT
from where i was stood a lot of older lads were causing a ruck but a lot of younger kids were looking to make a name for themselves or have a story to tell at school what the kids did was shameful and stupid but they are young they saw some of the older guys and copied, yes they should be punished but a life ban for them seems draconian, some restorative justice would be appropriate, whether that be spending some time putting right the mess they made or something of that nature, some might learn a lesson and in future not get involved, obviously some wont as for the older ones if they are identified well lets face it they will get a small fine and a ticking off or a community resolution, its water of a ducks back! FBO's are getting harder for courts to impose and enforce due to the very restrictive nature of them interestingly i was reading a few weeks back that any fan identified as a "risk" fan can be stopped from travelling and have passports removed etc, this can be for something as small as being filmed leaving a pub with known troublemakers, so the long and short is that some of us who were just nearby the aggro last night might now be noted as risk supporters.... With face recognition technology now available i think FBO`s should now be easier to inforce ? and as you say the young morons copied the older morons so adopt a tactic of being harsh on the older element and restorative justice for the younger elements. sorry when i say harder to enforce i mean harder to enforce with regards to the restrictions they place on people, i.e. foreign travel bans if England are abroad etc a decent lawyer can get them lifted or the terms lowered by claiming human rights breaches
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Dec 6, 2018 11:40:55 GMT
Yes, if you have it with you when you meet Guernsey Dave he will buy you a free pint! True Smug IDiocy is still alive and kicking Bottyprober ! GD I only posted for old times sake - to give you the chance to make your usual "Botty prober" comment, GD!
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ID Cards
Dec 6, 2018 12:18:27 GMT
via mobile
Post by 3putts on Dec 6, 2018 12:18:27 GMT
Talk about an overreaction An overreaction??? Ripping out seats to throw onto the pitch Throwing bottles, yes I know they were plastic, onto the pitch Smashing up the Gents showering glass into the area Stoke fans were waiting Yet more inane sectarian chanting A disgrace from a largish selection of older knuckle draggers and half wit teenagers who have just dragged our clubs name through the mud and seriously marred what should have been a good night out. Everybody knew that the majority were not there to watch stokes under21 team surely the away end should be awash with stewards and police where were they smurf?
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Dec 6, 2018 13:04:12 GMT
In places like Stoke there are always plenty of lads who want a fight , from the moment the draw was made it was obvious that given the opportunity it would go off as both clubs have plenty of people who would want trouble and there has been no game for such a long time ,
It was a badly organised fixture in lots of ways and I agree with the Bycars as a much better option for that game .
You can look at any game where there is a rivalry and there is a risk of trouble , I don't think this risk was well managed , there were 10 arrests at Brighton v Palace on the same night.
What I don't understand is the criminal damage that was truly pathetic behaviour in my view and must have placed some of their own fans at risk of getting hurt.
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Post by Gods on Dec 6, 2018 14:14:27 GMT
At Reading the average age of a Stoke fan was around 74 and I have seen a more threatening atmosphere at a Darby and Joan dominoes night This match was the exception not the rule ffs That is increasingly true of all our away games in the South. Don't know about naughty 40 our away support in the south looks more like pensioners club to me!
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Post by nigelkeyercoker on Dec 6, 2018 14:24:02 GMT
Talk about an overreaction An overreaction??? Ripping out seats to throw onto the pitch Throwing bottles, yes I know they were plastic, onto the pitch Smashing up the Gents showering glass into the area Stoke fans were waiting Yet more inane sectarian chanting A disgrace from a largish selection of older knuckle draggers and half wit teenagers who have just dragged our clubs name through the mud and seriously marred what should have been a good night out. Inane sectarian chanting? Have a day off mate, dont think that was a problem was it.
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Post by nigelkeyercoker on Dec 6, 2018 14:32:46 GMT
God, lets get this whole thing into perspective n all. 5 ***** trashed the toilets, out of 4000, and theyre stealing the headlines. I hope the people who did that are made to clean it up themselves. But lets not forget the vast majority of fans were well behaved. Too much attention given to a few idiots. And fuck me all the miserable bastards on there high horses, if it was 4000 of you cretins at every game, football would be dull as fuck with more atmosphere on the moon. That derby was one of the best atmospheres ive experienced in fucking years. I do not want to see a mass overreaction such as ID card being brought back, im sure many would agree.
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Post by Pretty Little Boother on Dec 6, 2018 19:19:41 GMT
I can almost guarantee this kind of trouble wont happen for a long time. Knobheads attend every match, this was different because the 'stewarding' / 'policing' was a total shambles. They let full capacity in the away end unreserved! If there was any organisation (like at every other normal game up and down the country, where fans are removed from stairways, told to sit down and healthy and safety procedures are adhered to) then i'd suggest alot of last nights mither in the away end would have been avoided. The police chose to simply stand between Vale & Stoke and they left the fans to there own devices, unfortunately, after alcohol and groups of lads get together, banter spills over and what happened, happened. What happened was a total disgrace, people smashing up toilets and what not, shocking. But given proper policing, it simply would not have had chance to have happened, and if it did, then the police could have simply removed the main culprits. Has it happened at any away day in the past 10-15-20 years?????? No! Either the Police or Vale thought it was advisable to put netting on the Railway Paddock seats in the corner. So why did they stand back and watch Vale fans rip it off to get closer to us? The entire railway stand should have been empty and Vale shift in the other end it was Complete Madness to allow both sets of supporters to be so close to each other. I also still can't believe that some genius thought it was a good idea to sell alcohol to Stoke supporters, some of whom had been on the piss or afternoon. Talk about adding fuel to the fire Don't blame the alcohol, it's the fault of the dicks who did it, nobody else's. Shouldn't punish the majority by denying them a drink or punish the Vale by way of sales just for a few fannies who would have simply got even more tanked up in the first place. One or two beers at halftime would be a drop in the ocean compared to the gallons of beer and coke they'd probably already had.
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ID Cards
Dec 6, 2018 20:14:52 GMT
via mobile
Post by stantheman on Dec 6, 2018 20:14:52 GMT
Either the Police or Vale thought it was advisable to put netting on the Railway Paddock seats in the corner. So why did they stand back and watch Vale fans rip it off to get closer to us? The entire railway stand should have been empty and Vale shift in the other end it was Complete Madness to allow both sets of supporters to be so close to each other. I also still can't believe that some genius thought it was a good idea to sell alcohol to Stoke supporters, some of whom had been on the piss or afternoon. Talk about adding fuel to the fire Don't blame the alcohol, it's the fault of the dicks who did it, nobody else's. Shouldn't punish the majority by denying them a drink or punish the Vale by way of sales just for a few fannies who would have simply got even more tanked up in the first place. One or two beers at halftime would be a drop in the ocean compared to the gallons of beer and coke they'd probably already had. The alcohol on sale was the last thing the already inflammatory night needed. I was amazed that half pissed Stoke fans were being handed bottles of ale. No surprise that they ended up on the pitch. Forget the Vale making a few quid, this was utter madness. Ask the Old Bill after the event if they should have allowed ale to be sold to our lot - not a cat in hells chance
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