|
|
Post by liathroid on Nov 19, 2018 10:14:37 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by mrred on Nov 19, 2018 10:15:06 GMT
Shaq, Bojan and Arnie as a front three, seems impossible to imagine now, what the fuck happened?  |
|
|
|
Post by greyman on Nov 19, 2018 10:18:00 GMT
And yet again, for those who think one of these three was not very good and the other two didn't want to be here.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Nov 19, 2018 10:47:00 GMT
Isn’t the great Bojan myth that he ever came close to contributing to the level that Arnie or even Shaq did? Hes had some good games but sadly it’s been blown out of all proportion. I've been watching Stoke for over 60 years. In that run of games before his injury at Rochdale, Bojan was showing the best form of any player we have had at the club since Hudson. No ifs, no buts, no maybe's. Had he not got injured and had he maintained that form, he would have been long gone from the club - leaving us with some wonderful memories - and a very large amount of money! Absolutely correct. He was among the very best players in the league at that time. That goal against Spurs at WHL was world class. |
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Nov 19, 2018 11:22:11 GMT
Presumably Martinez is toast now?
|
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Nov 19, 2018 12:06:48 GMT
Shaqiri looks infinitely fitter than he did at stoke Arnie looked fitter after leaving Stoke. Shaq looks fitter. Everyone looks fitter after leaving Stoke. You know what the problem is here? "All those players have terrible attitudes" - PC |
|
|
|
Post by milky on Nov 19, 2018 12:07:03 GMT
I bet if Hughes regrets one thing more than anything it may well be playing Bojan at Rochdale. Hindsight though eh ?
Sadly we never got to see what Shaqiri was all about often enough but the bits we did see we wont see the like of anytime soon.
Shaq and Arnie to McClean and Ince.
The process.
|
|
|
|
Post by wuzza on Nov 19, 2018 12:15:26 GMT
Isn’t the great Bojan myth that he ever came close to contributing to the level that Arnie or even Shaq did? Hes had some good games but sadly it’s been blown out of all proportion. I've been watching Stoke for over 60 years. In that run of games before his injury at Rochdale, Bojan was showing the best form of any player we have had at the club since Hudson. No ifs, no buts, no maybe's. Had he not got injured and had he maintained that form, he would have been long gone from the club - leaving us with some wonderful memories - and a very large amount of money! I think Mark Chamberlain did stuff far in excess of Bojan for example - Beagrie too and there were others. The whole point about Bojan is that as he had proved at many other clubs pre injury he is incapable of making a sustained impact. Nice while it happened but it happened for a VERY short period of time. |
|
|
|
Post by greyman on Nov 19, 2018 12:22:33 GMT
I've been watching Stoke for over 60 years. In that run of games before his injury at Rochdale, Bojan was showing the best form of any player we have had at the club since Hudson. No ifs, no buts, no maybe's. Had he not got injured and had he maintained that form, he would have been long gone from the club - leaving us with some wonderful memories - and a very large amount of money! I think Mark Chamberlain did stuff far in excess of Bojan for example - Beagrie too and there were others. The whole point about Bojan is that as he had proved at many other clubs pre injury he is incapable of making a sustained impact. Nice while it happened but it happened for a VERY short period of time. Like in the 163 games he played for Barcelona? That VERY short period of time? And Beagrie is better is he? Played fewer games for us and scored fewer goals and all in the second division. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2018 12:24:39 GMT
And yet again, for those who think one of these three was not very good and the other two didn't want to be here. What a terrible choice of highlights. Apart from the goals it shows nothing of our attacking in that game,the nutmegging,the pisstaking,the fact that we took Man C apart and could have been 5 up at HT |
|
|
|
Post by Bojan Mackey on Nov 19, 2018 12:57:46 GMT
And yet again, for those who think one of these three was not very good and the other two didn't want to be here. That was the game. That was the game I thought we were going to break into the Top 7. When you think about it we’ve been almost unbelievably docile about the fact that we managed to somehow fuck this up, it’s disgusting. I honestly believe we’d have twatted any team in world football on that day, it was unreal. And now we have James McLean. Someone should be in prison for it. |
|
|
|
Post by wuzza on Nov 19, 2018 13:07:36 GMT
I think Mark Chamberlain did stuff far in excess of Bojan for example - Beagrie too and there were others. The whole point about Bojan is that as he had proved at many other clubs pre injury he is incapable of making a sustained impact. Nice while it happened but it happened for a VERY short period of time. Like in the 163 games he played for Barcelona? That VERY short period of time? And Beagrie is better is he? Played fewer games for us and scored fewer goals and all in the second division. Provided just as many if not more skillfull moments as did Greenhoff as did Fuller etc etc etc. Bang the drum all you want but to try and peddle the theory that Bojan is under appreciated is ridiculous in my opinion. The opposite is true from what I saw. ... and none of that is to say he isnt a decent player and seemingly a very nice chap. (and if his time at Barca was anything like a success I doubt very much that his next port of call would be SoT.) |
|
|
|
Post by johnnysoul60 on Nov 19, 2018 13:18:39 GMT
yep I watched that , pretty much every touch he had had an impact, Liverpool seems to have done him the power of good , nice to see him playing so well .
|
|
|
|
Post by johnnysoul60 on Nov 19, 2018 13:24:54 GMT
Shaqiri looks infinitely fitter than he did at stoke Arnie looked fitter after leaving Stoke. Shaq looks fitter. Everyone looks fitter after leaving Stoke. You know what the problem is here? "All those players have terrible attitudes" - PC No doubt when you move to a Liverpool or a Man City you have to really up your levels or you don't get a look in with those two managers . Arnie should have a lot to thank Moyes for , he got into him early doors there and moved him to the centre and he has been superb since . |
|
|
|
Post by 3putts on Nov 19, 2018 13:25:21 GMT
And yet again, for those who think one of these three was not very good and the other two didn't want to be here. What a terrible choice of highlights. Apart from the goals it shows nothing of our attacking in that game,the nutmegging,the pisstaking,the fact that we took Man C apart and could have been 5 up at HT I remember watching that game in a bar in Thailand and I was so jealous that I wasn't there to see it "live" the interplay between the players was sublime I don't think I have ever seen a stoke team passing the ball via a backheel so many times in my life.these highlights aren't great but I wish we were half as good now |
|
|
|
Post by johnnysoul60 on Nov 19, 2018 13:25:37 GMT
Shaq, Bojan and Arnie as a front three, seems impossible to imagine now, what the fuck happened? We started to sign bad players |
|
|
|
Post by ProctorDre on Nov 19, 2018 13:45:05 GMT
Shaq, Bojan and Arnie as a front three, seems impossible to imagine now, what the fuck happened? Under Mr Rowett Shaq would probably be keeping Bojan company on the bench. No room for fancy dans while you’ve got the likes of McLean available! Bore off |
|
|
|
Post by reddipotter on Nov 19, 2018 13:51:21 GMT
You really can't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson who consistently controlled games over a significant period of time and on pitches that today's footballers wouldn't believe. Bojan had a brief period when he looked excellent but he has not really done so either before or after that. As to that front three, Hughes said at the time that he had been wondering about trying the formation for a while. In other words, no planning or building towards it, and as soon as it began to be found out (after only a few games) he abandoned it, completely incapable of finding a way that it might work. There you have the tactically inept disaster that was Hughes in a nutshell.
|
|
|
|
Post by metalhead on Nov 19, 2018 13:56:16 GMT
Arnie looked fitter after leaving Stoke. Shaq looks fitter. Everyone looks fitter after leaving Stoke. You know what the problem is here? "All those players have terrible attitudes" - PC No doubt when you move to a Liverpool or a Man City you have to really up your levels or you don't get a look in with those two managers . Arnie should have a lot to thank Moyes for , he got into him early doors there and moved him to the centre and he has been superb since . So you don't think our fitness regime is fucked? |
|
|
|
Post by greyman on Nov 19, 2018 14:49:15 GMT
Like in the 163 games he played for Barcelona? That VERY short period of time? And Beagrie is better is he? Played fewer games for us and scored fewer goals and all in the second division. Provided just as many if not more skillfull moments as did Greenhoff as did Fuller etc etc etc. Bang the drum all you want but to try and peddle the theory that Bojan is under appreciated is ridiculous in my opinion. The opposite is true from what I saw. ... and none of that is to say he isnt a decent player and seemingly a very nice chap. (and if his time at Barca was anything like a success I doubt very much that his next port of call would be SoT.) Yeah, well I think you see what you want to see and no amount of facts will change your mind. I note that you completely ignored the fact he played 163 times for Barcelona including dozens of games in the Champions League. But then that doesn't fit with your opinions does it? Well done for keeping on trying to argue that he's not as good as Peter Beagrie as well. As far as opinions go that's definitely an opinion. His next port of call after Barcelona wasn't SoT either, was it? |
|
|
|
Post by Paul Spencer on Nov 19, 2018 14:49:21 GMT
And yet again, for those who think one of these three was not very good and the other two didn't want to be here. Just stop it, please ... |
|
|
|
Post by johnnysoul60 on Nov 19, 2018 15:06:04 GMT
No doubt when you move to a Liverpool or a Man City you have to really up your levels or you don't get a look in with those two managers . Arnie should have a lot to thank Moyes for , he got into him early doors there and moved him to the centre and he has been superb since . So you don't think our fitness regime is fucked? I don't think we have been fit enough since the days of TP overall, Hughes seemed to have his methods that seemed to produce slow starts but then seemed to be ok until the last two seasons where everything went tits up . Lambert tried to make a difference and they did work harder as a unit but he never got a pre-season Rowett as I recall said he was going to play a high tempo pressing game that they would need to be fit to play , I've not seen much evidence of high or pressing yet . I think when you look at Shaq and Arnie , maturity has something to do with it . Arnie knows its the time in his career to either prove how good he is or have the regret of not fulfilling his talent and I think Moyes gave him that belief he could be a top player ( To be fair Hughes did a hell of a lot for him too because he was in the wilderness a bit when he came to us ). Shaq must have felt flat moving from Bayern to Inter then Stoke and getting relegated but he has had a new lease of life and has to earn his place there , he never really had to for us did he? He could have a few bad games here , I don't think he can now and he must be buzzing playing with loads of players who see the game like he can |
|
|
|
Post by Lakeland Potter on Nov 19, 2018 16:05:06 GMT
You really can't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson who consistently controlled games over a significant period of time and on pitches that today's footballers wouldn't believe. Bojan had a brief period when he looked excellent but he has not really done so either before or after that. As to that front three, Hughes said at the time that he had been wondering about trying the formation for a while. In other words, no planning or building towards it, and as soon as it began to be found out (after only a few games) he abandoned it, completely incapable of finding a way that it might work. There you have the tactically inept disaster that was Hughes in a nutshell. I didn't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson in terms of his ability over a significant period of time. I said that in the run of games up to his injury at Rochdale he looked to be the best player we have had since Hudson. Obviously he has not been at that elevated level since the injury - we are all well aware of that. But, given his dedication to training, I have no doubt that, had Bojan not suffered that injury at Rochdale, he would have carried on performing at or close to the level he was showing (just before his injury) for a good few years. Some players burn brightly for a while and then their temperament and/or their dubious lifestyle means that their performance declines quite quickly. Bojan was never that type of player - it took a bad injury to leave him a shadow of his former self, despite all the effort he put in to his recovery. |
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Nov 19, 2018 16:10:45 GMT
So you don't think our fitness regime is fucked? I don't think we have been fit enough since the days of TP overall, Hughes seemed to have his methods that seemed to produce slow starts but then seemed to be ok until the last two seasons where everything went tits up . Lambert tried to make a difference and they did work harder as a unit but he never got a pre-season Rowett as I recall said he was going to play a high tempo pressing game that they would need to be fit to play , I've not seen much evidence of high or pressing yet . I think when you look at Shaq and Arnie , maturity has something to do with it . Arnie knows its the time in his career to either prove how good he is or have the regret of not fulfilling his talent and I think Moyes gave him that belief he could be a top player ( To be fair Hughes did a hell of a lot for him too because he was in the wilderness a bit when he came to us ). Shaq must have felt flat moving from Bayern to Inter then Stoke and getting relegated but he has had a new lease of life and has to earn his place there , he never really had to for us did he? He could have a few bad games here , I don't think he can now and he must be buzzing playing with loads of players who see the game like he can Pulis's team ran out of steam towards the end of the game and were prone to conceding late. Plus at the back end of each season his teams fade. Knowing what I know, Pulis is no fitness guru. His mantra is shape shape shape. His players know where to be on the pitch so don't spend a lot of time running around like headless chickens, SJW being the exception. |
|
|
|
Post by trickydicky73 on Nov 19, 2018 16:19:39 GMT
I don't think we have been fit enough since the days of TP overall, Hughes seemed to have his methods that seemed to produce slow starts but then seemed to be ok until the last two seasons where everything went tits up . Lambert tried to make a difference and they did work harder as a unit but he never got a pre-season Rowett as I recall said he was going to play a high tempo pressing game that they would need to be fit to play , I've not seen much evidence of high or pressing yet . I think when you look at Shaq and Arnie , maturity has something to do with it . Arnie knows its the time in his career to either prove how good he is or have the regret of not fulfilling his talent and I think Moyes gave him that belief he could be a top player ( To be fair Hughes did a hell of a lot for him too because he was in the wilderness a bit when he came to us ). Shaq must have felt flat moving from Bayern to Inter then Stoke and getting relegated but he has had a new lease of life and has to earn his place there , he never really had to for us did he? He could have a few bad games here , I don't think he can now and he must be buzzing playing with loads of players who see the game like he can Pulis's team ran out of steam towards the end of the game and were prone to conceding late. Plus at the back end of each season his teams fade. Knowing what I know, Pulis is no fitness guru. His mantra is shape shape shape. His players know where to be on the pitch so don't spend a lot of time running around like headless chickens, SJW being the exception. They were Stoke fit though. |
|
|
|
Post by Pugsley on Nov 19, 2018 16:23:08 GMT
Pulis's team ran out of steam towards the end of the game and were prone to conceding late. Plus at the back end of each season his teams fade. Knowing what I know, Pulis is no fitness guru. His mantra is shape shape shape. His players know where to be on the pitch so don't spend a lot of time running around like headless chickens, SJW being the exception. They were Stoke fit though. Indeed, that was good enough. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2018 16:32:49 GMT
Provided just as many if not more skillfull moments as did Greenhoff as did Fuller etc etc etc. Bang the drum all you want but to try and peddle the theory that Bojan is under appreciated is ridiculous in my opinion. The opposite is true from what I saw. ... and none of that is to say he isnt a decent player and seemingly a very nice chap. (and if his time at Barca was anything like a success I doubt very much that his next port of call would be SoT.) Yeah, well I think you see what you want to see and no amount of facts will change your mind. I note that you completely ignored the fact he played 163 times for Barcelona including dozens of games in the Champions League. But then that doesn't fit with your opinions does it? Well done for keeping on trying to argue that he's not as good as Peter Beagrie as well. As far as opinions go that's definitely an opinion. His next port of call after Barcelona wasn't SoT either, was it? Wikipedia says 104 appearances, presumably many as a sub |
|
|
|
Post by Mr_DaftBurger on Nov 19, 2018 16:42:36 GMT
You really can't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson who consistently controlled games over a significant period of time and on pitches that today's footballers wouldn't believe. Bojan had a brief period when he looked excellent but he has not really done so either before or after that. As to that front three, Hughes said at the time that he had been wondering about trying the formation for a while. In other words, no planning or building towards it, and as soon as it began to be found out (after only a few games) he abandoned it, completely incapable of finding a way that it might work. There you have the tactically inept disaster that was Hughes in a nutshell. I didn't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson in terms of his ability over a significant period of time. I said that in the run of games up to his injury at Rochdale he looked to be the best player we have had since Hudson. Obviously he has not been at that elevated level since the injury - we are all well aware of that. But, given his dedication to training, I have no doubt that, had Bojan not suffered that injury at Rochdale, he would have carried on performing at or close to the level he was showing (just before his injury) for a good few years. Some players burn brightly for a while and then their temperament and/or their dubious lifestyle means that their performance declines quite quickly. Bojan was never that type of player - it took a bad injury to leave him a shadow of his former self, despite all the effort he put in to his recovery. If Bojan hadn't had his injury he'd have left the next summer.  |
|
|
|
Post by Lakeland Potter on Nov 19, 2018 17:10:28 GMT
I didn't put Bojan in the same category as Hudson in terms of his ability over a significant period of time. I said that in the run of games up to his injury at Rochdale he looked to be the best player we have had since Hudson. Obviously he has not been at that elevated level since the injury - we are all well aware of that. But, given his dedication to training, I have no doubt that, had Bojan not suffered that injury at Rochdale, he would have carried on performing at or close to the level he was showing (just before his injury) for a good few years. Some players burn brightly for a while and then their temperament and/or their dubious lifestyle means that their performance declines quite quickly. Bojan was never that type of player - it took a bad injury to leave him a shadow of his former self, despite all the effort he put in to his recovery. If Bojan hadn't had his injury he'd have left the next summer. That's probably true - but given the four years left on his contract we'd have made a profit which would have dwarfed the 20 million or so profit we made on Arnie. |
|
|
|
Post by greyman on Nov 19, 2018 19:38:21 GMT
Yeah, well I think you see what you want to see and no amount of facts will change your mind. I note that you completely ignored the fact he played 163 times for Barcelona including dozens of games in the Champions League. But then that doesn't fit with your opinions does it? Well done for keeping on trying to argue that he's not as good as Peter Beagrie as well. As far as opinions go that's definitely an opinion. His next port of call after Barcelona wasn't SoT either, was it? Wikipedia says 104 appearances, presumably many as a sub Try again. Presumably, what? |
|
