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Post by stokemark on Jul 14, 2016 21:33:12 GMT
I hope we sort out rules for science and science funding pronto. I was at a conference last week and found out why my job opportunities have gone to shit - the UK is being dropped from contract bids to Horizon 2020, the £50-odd billion EU science project. Until now we've been winning far more from the EU than we put in, and it's basically the only reason we've been able to maintain our world-class science position after the last parliament cut science funding by 17% after inflation. Hopefully the new government will either guarantee us access to Horizon 2020 (which means following EU regs in the research, paying in and freedom of movement), or boost the science budget. We need a 20% increase to cancel out the loss of EU money, plus another boost to cancel out the lower efficiency from lost collaborations and another boost to handle the expected inflation and to make UK salaries competitive again. Welcome to the real world pal when are you going to stop moaning about the handouts you won't get from Brussels and join the Rat race like the rest of us Yes 'pal' why waste all your knowledge and talent on trying to advance science for the good of mankind - far better off on the dole with the other 6 million who soon will be too
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 15, 2016 8:26:36 GMT
The sacked Tory minister Oliver Letwin, who was the minister in charge of the newly formed Brexit team was on the Today program this morning. He was asked how many trade negotiations we had in position to draw up plans for Brexit. Last estimates were 12. He said we don't have many, cause they all work for the EU. He was pressed, but wouldn't answer. Canada had 300 to negotiat their deal(CETA)with the EU & they don't have the deal that we will be after...
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Post by starkiller on Jul 15, 2016 8:30:48 GMT
The sacked Tory minister Oliver Letwin, who was the minister in charge of the newly formed Brexit team was on the Today program this morning. He was asked how many trade negotiations we had in position to draw up plans for Brexit. Last estimates were 12. He said we don't have many, cause they all work for the EU. He was pressed, but wouldn't answer. Canada had 300 to negotiat their deal(CETA)with the EU & they don't have the deal that we will be after... The issue is clearly not Brexit but piss-poor government run by incompetents. The last couple of weeks have shown up Parliament for how useless it is. Never mind, at least in there they can have a laugh and a joke and people think it's great. A real purge is needed.
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 15, 2016 8:45:12 GMT
The sacked Tory minister Oliver Letwin, who was the minister in charge of the newly formed Brexit team was on the Today program this morning. He was asked how many trade negotiations we had in position to draw up plans for Brexit. Last estimates were 12. He said we don't have many, cause they all work for the EU. He was pressed, but wouldn't answer. Canada had 300 to negotiat their deal(CETA)with the EU & they don't have the deal that we will be after... The issue is clearly not Brexit but piss-poor government run by incompetents. The last couple of weeks have shown up Parliament for how useless it is. Never mind, at least in there they can have a laugh and a joke and people think it's great. A real purge is needed. It's pretty obvious that the new headgirl thinks something similar.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2016 9:07:19 GMT
The issue is clearly not Brexit but piss-poor government run by incompetents. The last couple of weeks have shown up Parliament for how useless it is. Never mind, at least in there they can have a laugh and a joke and people think it's great. A real purge is needed. It's pretty obvious that the new headgirl thinks something similar. Is she doing it (including rhetoric) for the right reasons tho, or just to stop the exodus of foot soldiers and voters to other parties? Or is she doing the same as all the governments before and trying to pull the wool rather than truly addressing the issues of the voting public
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Post by Skankmonkey on Jul 15, 2016 10:29:35 GMT
I hope we sort out rules for science and science funding pronto. I was at a conference last week and found out why my job opportunities have gone to shit - the UK is being dropped from contract bids to Horizon 2020, the £50-odd billion EU science project. Until now we've been winning far more from the EU than we put in, and it's basically the only reason we've been able to maintain our world-class science position after the last parliament cut science funding by 17% after inflation. Hopefully the new government will either guarantee us access to Horizon 2020 (which means following EU regs in the research, paying in and freedom of movement), or boost the science budget. We need a 20% increase to cancel out the loss of EU money, plus another boost to cancel out the lower efficiency from lost collaborations and another boost to handle the expected inflation and to make UK salaries competitive again. Having read this post I'm starting to seriously regret voting Leave. We were such backward country who offered absolutley zero to science (and technology) for our entire existance before we joined the wonderful EU. Forgotten the "Brain Drain" in the sixties then DC? The brightest and best went to the US back then.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2016 11:50:32 GMT
Having read this post I'm starting to seriously regret voting Leave. We were such backward country who offered absolutley zero to science (and technology) for our entire existance before we joined the wonderful EU. Forgotten the "Brain Drain" in the sixties then DC? The brightest and best went to the US back then. What was the rest of Europe like in the 60's I think Everywhere apart from the USA were behind the times in the 60's
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Post by mtrstudent on Jul 15, 2016 15:34:35 GMT
]Welcome to the real world pal when are you going to stop moaning about the handouts you won't get from Brussels and join the Rat race like the rest of us Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best.
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Post by harryburrows on Jul 15, 2016 15:40:34 GMT
]Welcome to the real world pal when are you going to stop moaning about the handouts you won't get from Brussels and join the Rat race like the rest of us Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best. Just have faith in our future is all I'm saying , we will have some tough situations in the near future . We are a great country and we shouldn't rely on handouts from those corrupt Arseholes in Brussels . Ask the people in our fishing industry what the eu did for them
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Post by mtrstudent on Jul 15, 2016 15:51:29 GMT
Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best. Just have faith in our future is all I'm saying , we will have some tough situations in the near future . We are a great country and we shouldn't rely on handouts from those corrupt Arseholes in Brussels . Ask the people in our fishing industry what the eu did for them They're contracts that we won competitively, not handouts. Faith doesn't launch satellites or build scanning electron microscopes - if we want to stay near the top of the science field then we need our politicians to pull their fingers out very quickly and either guarantee we'll follow EU rules for Horizon 2020 or do a big increase in the science budget. The other Brits I know are in the same boat as me. We want to come back but can't do that without risking our careers - we've all been successful here and our employers want to keep us, and some of us have been approached by other non-UK employers. I wouldn't be surprised if this is true of lots of people with technical skills that're in demand like computer programmers, doctors etc. Faith won't fix it, politicians can.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2016 16:40:08 GMT
Just have faith in our future is all I'm saying , we will have some tough situations in the near future . We are a great country and we shouldn't rely on handouts from those corrupt Arseholes in Brussels . Ask the people in our fishing industry what the eu did for them They're contracts that we won competitively, not handouts. Faith doesn't launch satellites or build scanning electron microscopes - if we want to stay near the top of the science field then we need our politicians to pull their fingers out very quickly and either guarantee we'll follow EU rules for Horizon 2020 or do a big increase in the science budget. The other Brits I know are in the same boat as me. We want to come back but can't do that without risking our careers - we've all been successful here and our employers want to keep us, and some of us have been approached by other non-UK employers. I wouldn't be surprised if this is true of lots of people with technical skills that're in demand like computer programmers, doctors etc. Faith won't fix it, politicians can. I voted out....My lads an Astrophysics student ....he voted out.....the world is a big place .....nothing lasts forever ....things will change ...some things will be good.....some things will be bad .....time will tell ......I'm glad we are not being taken down the shit pan by those fucking idiots in Brussels If all goes well the whole thing will collapse and the eu will become the eec again .....all thanks to us.....Great Britain
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Jul 15, 2016 17:07:36 GMT
David Cameron after his Brexit has given his advisers golden good-bye severance packages! Millions gave David a golden good-bye in the referendum. When do we get our monies?
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Post by chiswickpotter on Jul 15, 2016 17:32:55 GMT
Alot has been caused by what the Italians are doing. Its hurt both the pound and dollar. Wait till yhe US election comes. Youll probably get similar effects. How has it hurt pound and dollar? Relative to what, the Euro? An Italian banking crisis is always going to hit the Euro surely
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 15, 2016 19:42:22 GMT
David Cameron after his Brexit has given his advisers golden good-bye severance packages! Millions gave David a golden good-bye in the referendum. When do we get our monies? It's V easy to give tax payers money away. Snidey cnut
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Post by salopstick on Jul 15, 2016 19:45:53 GMT
Cameron takes less than Blair did. He changed the rules.
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Jul 15, 2016 19:50:04 GMT
David Cameron after his Brexit has given his advisers golden good-bye severance packages! Millions gave David a golden good-bye in the referendum. When do we get our monies? It's V easy to give tax payers money away. Snidey cnut But civil servants advised Cameron not to do it? The trouble with you Tories is you don't like the facts and the truth!
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Jul 15, 2016 19:53:26 GMT
Cameron takes less than Blair did. He changed the rules. This money relates to his advisers! Cameron gave more of our money away than the civil servants said he should! Cameron takes less than Blair? Given his family have had a fortune in offshore funds avoiding tax, so Cameron should take less! After all, his family have made sure they've paid in less!
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 15, 2016 20:13:34 GMT
It's V easy to give tax payers money away. Snidey cnut But civil servants advised Cameron not to do it? The trouble with you Tories is you don't like the facts and the truth! How V dare U. I am no Tory
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Jul 15, 2016 20:23:03 GMT
But civil servants advised Cameron not to do it? The trouble with you Tories is you don't like the facts and the truth! How V dare U. I am no Tory I apologise! You just sound like one!
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Post by bathstoke on Jul 15, 2016 20:29:30 GMT
How V dare U. I am no Tory I apologise! You just sound like one! It gets worse
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jul 15, 2016 22:10:04 GMT
]Welcome to the real world pal when are you going to stop moaning about the handouts you won't get from Brussels and join the Rat race like the rest of us Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best. So you want Great Britain to remain in the EU so that we can keep hold of all these brainy folk... Of which you are one. And you sooo wish you could return to Great Britain 'cos you've been 'forced' to work in the US because we're not a part of the EU... No hang on, that isn't right, we've been in the EU for decades, but you & all you brainy mates work in the US 'cos we're not in the EU... No hang on, none of this is making sense. Great Britain was in the EU but you & all your mates apparently fucked off to work in the US. Now you're saying you'd all love to come back to Great Britain but can't/wont 'cos we're no longer in the 'club' that we were in when you fucked off in the first place. Forgive me if I think you're full of, and speak, an absolute fucking lorry load of shit.
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Post by Gods on Jul 15, 2016 22:25:10 GMT
It's looking more and more like a massive fuck up with every passing day. We 'remainers' are supposed to be the brainy half of the population so put your thinking caps on, but I can't see an escape route
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jul 15, 2016 22:42:05 GMT
]Welcome to the real world pal when are you going to stop moaning about the handouts you won't get from Brussels and join the Rat race like the rest of us Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best. So am I right in thinking that you benefited from EU funding during your science studies here in the UK but are now working in the USA? So that worked out then. For you.
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Jul 15, 2016 22:48:00 GMT
Research makes countries richer and I want it to be done in Britain because I love both Britain and science. This "fuck you" attitude to young people who learn technical skills isn't helping, but the main problem is that the government took away 17% of science funding. We'd replaced that by being good at winning EU contracts but now that is gone. We need the government to sort this shit right now - either follow EU rules and get us Horizon 2020, or add 20-25% to the science budget to replace the lost contracts and add a chunk more to make UK salaries competitive and to guarantee access to top tech. I want to come back to the UK, but I also want to work hard and discover interesting stuff and (I know this is fucking cheeky) earn enough to live and support my family if they need help (Nan's not well), pay off my loans and maybe even get a mortgage sometime in my 40s. I can carry on my job in the US, I've been asked to apply to positions in France and Sweden, or I go back to Kidsgrove Tesco where my record says "would re-hire". Do you want Britain to remain a top place to do science that keeps hold of its best talent and attracts it from the rest of the world? If you don't care then that's fine, but I do and I want the politicians to sort this shit out quickly before we cripple ourselves and become an average country for research, instead of one of the best. So am I right in thinking that you benefited from EU funding during your science studies here in the UK but are now working in the USA? So that worked out then. For you. Let's be clear here. Cameron a few weeks ago was questioned about gaps in E.U. funding when we leave e.g. farming. Science in the U.K. benefits as well as urban projects[from E.U. grants]. The big question is will the U.K. government make up the shortfall? Cameron didn't answer?
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Post by Gods on Jul 15, 2016 23:10:25 GMT
So am I right in thinking that you benefited from EU funding during your science studies here in the UK but are now working in the USA? So that worked out then. For you. Let's be clear here. Cameron a few weeks ago was questioned about gaps in E.U. funding when we leave e.g. farming. Science in the U.K. benefits as well as urban projects[from E.U. grants]. The big question is will the U.K. government make up the shortfall? Cameron didn't answer? Well it's not going to be possible is it? We have already abandoned the plans we had to pay off our national debt in anticipation of the brave new brexit world, the interest on which is more than the entire education budget incidentally. Some serious belt tightening is coming up that will make the previous stuff like a picnic.
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Post by mtrstudent on Jul 16, 2016 2:34:07 GMT
And you sooo wish you could return to Great Britain 'cos you've been 'forced' to work in the US because we're not a part of the EU... No hang on, that isn't right, we've been in the EU for decades, but you & all you brainy mates work in the US 'cos we're not in the EU... No hang on, none of this is making sense. Great Britain was in the EU but you & all your mates apparently fucked off to work in the US. Now you're saying you'd all love to come back to Great Britain but can't/wont 'cos we're no longer in the 'club' that we were in when you fucked off in the first place. Forgive me if I think you're full of, and speak, an absolute fucking lorry load of shit. I only said that I want politicians to quickly tell us either that we'll keep access to Horizon 2020 or guarantee they'll plug the money gap. Brexit politicians promised they would, but we've heard nothing and seen no money on the table. The UK research project budget is £3.7 billion plus £1.1 bn for other stuff like overheads and kit. Our unis win about £1.2 billion from the EU and we also get money through European centres like the Space Agency in Didcot, weather forecasting in Reading, medicines agency in London etc. Less money for science means less science, isn't that obvious? As for my mates and me: we're doing the temporary J1 visa exchange program. We've all had similar experiences when talking with Brexit-voters at home: a kind of big "fuck off" attitude aimed at us for trying to learn to do jobs that we thought were exciting and worthwhile. But for us it's just a fact that UK job opportunities have gone to shit and we need the politicians to pull their fingers out or the UK is going to lose people with technical skills. I'm worried for UK research because I think it's important, we're good at it and it's good for Britain. Are you happy for us to surrender that, or do you agree with me that the government should be guaranteeing the money for science and should do it quickly?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2016 7:49:04 GMT
And you sooo wish you could return to Great Britain 'cos you've been 'forced' to work in the US because we're not a part of the EU... No hang on, that isn't right, we've been in the EU for decades, but you & all you brainy mates work in the US 'cos we're not in the EU... No hang on, none of this is making sense. Great Britain was in the EU but you & all your mates apparently fucked off to work in the US. Now you're saying you'd all love to come back to Great Britain but can't/wont 'cos we're no longer in the 'club' that we were in when you fucked off in the first place. Forgive me if I think you're full of, and speak, an absolute fucking lorry load of shit. I only said that I want politicians to quickly tell us either that we'll keep access to Horizon 2020 or guarantee they'll plug the money gap. Brexit politicians promised they would, but we've heard nothing and seen no money on the table. The UK research project budget is £3.7 billion plus £1.1 bn for other stuff like overheads and kit. Our unis win about £1.2 billion from the EU and we also get money through European centres like the Space Agency in Didcot, weather forecasting in Reading, medicines agency in London etc. Less money for science means less science, isn't that obvious? As for my mates and me: we're doing the temporary J1 visa exchange program. We've all had similar experiences when talking with Brexit-voters at home: a kind of big "fuck off" attitude aimed at us for trying to learn to do jobs that we thought were exciting and worthwhile. But for us it's just a fact that UK job opportunities have gone to shit and we need the politicians to pull their fingers out or the UK is going to lose people with technical skills. I'm worried for UK research because I think it's important, we're good at it and it's good for Britain. Are you happy for us to surrender that, or do you agree with me that the government should be guaranteeing the money for science and should do it quickly? Its a shame you haven't got a bit of frog in you, you could stay on the gravy train
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Post by capto on Jul 16, 2016 13:07:01 GMT
I only said that I want politicians to quickly tell us either that we'll keep access to Horizon 2020 or guarantee they'll plug the money gap. Brexit politicians promised they would, but we've heard nothing and seen no money on the table. The UK research project budget is £3.7 billion plus £1.1 bn for other stuff like overheads and kit. Our unis win about £1.2 billion from the EU and we also get money through European centres like the Space Agency in Didcot, weather forecasting in Reading, medicines agency in London etc. Less money for science means less science, isn't that obvious? As for my mates and me: we're doing the temporary J1 visa exchange program. We've all had similar experiences when talking with Brexit-voters at home: a kind of big "fuck off" attitude aimed at us for trying to learn to do jobs that we thought were exciting and worthwhile. But for us it's just a fact that UK job opportunities have gone to shit and we need the politicians to pull their fingers out or the UK is going to lose people with technical skills. I'm worried for UK research because I think it's important, we're good at it and it's good for Britain. Are you happy for us to surrender that, or do you agree with me that the government should be guaranteeing the money for science and should do it quickly? Its a shame you haven't got a bit of frog in you, you could stay on the gravy train It's a good point (!!!) but I can't see how that answers the points raised - unless we want to go down to the xenophobic level?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2016 14:56:19 GMT
Its a shame you haven't got a bit of frog in you, you could stay on the gravy train It's a good point (!!!) but I can't see how that answers the points raised - unless we want to go down to the xenophobic level?
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Post by felonious on Jul 16, 2016 16:47:50 GMT
It's a good point (!!!) but I can't see how that answers the points raised - unless we want to go down to the xenophobic level? Are you suggesting he's a tranny, like you.....or a Cupid Stunt, like you?
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