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Post by Staying up for Grandadstokey on Jun 28, 2016 12:24:12 GMT
. You have more faith in these exciting young creative players,( whoever they are) than I have I'm afraid. Not a single player has enhanced his reputation during this tournament. Just because they haven't impressed during this tournament doesn't make them crap. They may not be crap, but they are not good enough at International level to progress us ,therefore a rethink about the whole set up is needed by someone with tactical awareness and motivational skills, neither of which Woy possessed.
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Post by foster on Jun 28, 2016 12:31:43 GMT
A Pulis England XI Hart Stones Shawcross Smalling Jones Welbeck Dier Drinkwater Townsend Carroll Kane If you made a serious one (add Full backs and TP type wingers) - swapping out Hart for Butland. It would actually be a very solid looking side.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2016 12:40:49 GMT
Bumped into an England fan this morning, saying that he's never going to watch them again!
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 13:17:57 GMT
A Pulis England XI Hart Stones Shawcross Smalling Jones Welbeck Dier Drinkwater Townsend Carroll Kane If you made a serious one (add Full backs and TP type wingers) - swapping out Hart for Butland. It would actually be a very solid looking side. It was a serious one. He doesn't do full backs.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 13:18:50 GMT
Just because they haven't impressed during this tournament doesn't make them crap. They may not be crap, but they are not good enough at International level to progress us ,therefore a rethink about the whole set up is needed by someone with tactical awareness and motivational skills, neither of which Woy possessed. They're better than we've had for a good while and used properly by a better manager are capable of better.
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Post by UsAndThem on Jun 28, 2016 13:19:35 GMT
This is not as daft as it seems. I'd never want TP anywhere near Stoke again but I think he'd do a good job on the international scene given a chance. He'd give England rigidity, shape and have them tight defensively. He unexpectedly got us to the final of the FA Cup.
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Post by senojbor on Jun 28, 2016 14:35:07 GMT
Tony Pulis would make an excellent England manager.
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Post by Theninjabadger on Jun 28, 2016 14:46:16 GMT
A Pulis England XI Hart Stones Shawcross Smalling Jones Welbeck Dier Drinkwater Townsend Carroll Kane If you made a serious one (add Full backs and TP type wingers) - swapping out Hart for Butland. It would actually be a very solid looking side. TP type wingers? For every Pennant and Etherington there's a Cresswell and Shotton
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Post by generationex on Jun 28, 2016 14:49:34 GMT
He's perfect - England are in reality an average group of players that need to depend on teamwork and organisation to stand the best chance.
Sooner the FA wakes up to the facts the better.
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Post by Staying up for Grandadstokey on Jun 28, 2016 14:59:35 GMT
They may not be crap, but they are not good enough at International level to progress us ,therefore a rethink about the whole set up is needed by someone with tactical awareness and motivational skills, neither of which Woy possessed. They're better than we've had for a good while and used properly by a better manager are capable of better. I disagree, none of our younger generation are any better (With the exception of Butland than those in the past and certainly we have no one that can hold a candle to the likes of Lampard , Gerrard ,Beckham etc and we never performed that well with them.
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sifta
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Post by sifta on Jun 28, 2016 15:00:45 GMT
When he inherited a good bunch of players at Palace, they were good to watch.
Also its very convenient to forget that we did play some great football at times, beat some top teams, got to a cup final, in style although we were pretty much running on empty at the end.
He also negotiated his way through the qualifying stages in Europe, and no way would he be "resting" players in the Finals (I would hope)
To be honest though, that said, I would prefer Allardyce
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 15:03:49 GMT
They're better than we've had for a good while and used properly by a better manager are capable of better. I disagree, none of our younger generation are any better (With the exception of Butland than those in the past and certainly we have no one that can hold a candle to the likes of Lampard , Gerrard ,Beckham etc and we never performed that well with them. They're better than what we took to the last 2-3 tournaments.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 15:06:08 GMT
He's perfect - England are in reality an average group of players that need to depend on teamwork and organisation to stand the best chance. Sooner the FA wakes up to the facts the better. The players we have aren't suited to his style of play. Unless we're jettisoning the likes of Clyne, Walker, Rose, Sturridge, Rashford, Lallana, Delle Alli,etc. We need to develop and nurture good technical footballers, not turn our back on that side of the game forever. We need to try and step into the light, not retreat into the darkness.
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sifta
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Post by sifta on Jun 28, 2016 15:11:41 GMT
I'm pretty sure that had TP been in charge, I'd now be working out where to watch the France v England game, and I'd think we had a chance of winning it.
But like I said, my preferred option is Sam
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sifta
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Post by sifta on Jun 28, 2016 15:25:01 GMT
The vote results on the BBC website has 17 names, none of them TP
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Post by iplayinthehole on Jun 28, 2016 15:52:52 GMT
He's perfect - England are in reality an average group of players that need to depend on teamwork and organisation to stand the best chance. Sooner the FA wakes up to the facts the better. The players we have aren't suited to his style of play. Unless we're jettisoning the likes of Clyne, Walker, Rose, Sturridge, Rashford, Lallana, Delle Alli,etc. We need to develop and nurture good technical footballers, not turn our back on that side of the game forever. We need to try and step into the light, not retreat into the darkness. Sorry mate, but that's utter, utter nonsense. Tournament football is not the same as club football. Nothing like it in terms of player development. We needed a plan last night, along with the gumption, willingness and guile to execute it. I saw no plan, just a shoehorned team of the 'best players'. Quite rightly we got beat, like Arse did when they arrogantly assumed we would roll over on our own patch. At least Pulis would prepare the team and have a plan, even if it wasn't to your personal tastes. Personally my choice would be Rafa. He knows England, many of the players, and is an excellent cup competition manager with a proven track record, which is everything you need.
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Post by generationex on Jun 28, 2016 16:02:50 GMT
He's perfect - England are in reality an average group of players that need to depend on teamwork and organisation to stand the best chance. Sooner the FA wakes up to the facts the better. The players we have aren't suited to his style of play. Unless we're jettisoning the likes of Clyne, Walker, Rose, Sturridge, Rashford, Lallana, Delle Alli,etc. We need to develop and nurture good technical footballers, not turn our back on that side of the game forever. We need to try and step into the light, not retreat into the darkness. That's the England delusion in a nutshell. They're not good enough. If we DO develop good technical footballers we should employ a manager that can work with them. Find the next Wenger. Have another 10 year plan. Until we do let's stop wasting every tournament
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 16:03:29 GMT
The players we have aren't suited to his style of play. Unless we're jettisoning the likes of Clyne, Walker, Rose, Sturridge, Rashford, Lallana, Delle Alli,etc. We need to develop and nurture good technical footballers, not turn our back on that side of the game forever. We need to try and step into the light, not retreat into the darkness. Sorry mate, but that's utter, utter nonsense. Tournament football is not the same as club football. Nothing like it in terms of player development. We needed a plan last night, along with the gumption, willingness and guile to execute it. I saw no plan, just a shoehorned team of the 'best players'. Quite rightly we got beat, like Arse did when they arrogantly assumed we would roll over on our own patch. At least Pulis would prepare the team and have a plan, even if it wasn't to your personal tastes. Personally my choice would be Rafa. He knows England, many of the players, and is an excellent cup competition manager with a proven track record, which is everything you need. I'm not sure I've made my point clear. One of the biggest problems with England, whoever the manager is, is that we don't produce players with either the football brain or technical ability to be successful at international level. If we're going to start producing them, at any level, surely we need someone in charge at the very top of the game who believes in those same qualities, rather than ignoring them in favour of lumping a big diagonal to the big man. Would he have beaten Iceland? Yeah, almost certainly. But is that literally all we're asking for? The 'plan' he'd have had doesn't suit the best players we have at our disposal. Again, unless you're happy to ignore the Delle Allis, Luke Shaws and Rashfords in the world in favour of the Andy Carrolls.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 16:04:35 GMT
The players we have aren't suited to his style of play. Unless we're jettisoning the likes of Clyne, Walker, Rose, Sturridge, Rashford, Lallana, Delle Alli,etc. We need to develop and nurture good technical footballers, not turn our back on that side of the game forever. We need to try and step into the light, not retreat into the darkness. That's the England delusion in a nutshell. They're not good enough. If we DO develop good technical footballers we should employ a manager that can work with them. Find the next Wenger. Have another 10 year plan. Until we do let's stop wasting every tournament What's the English delusion, sorry? I think we do need another 10 year plan. We need to stop looking for quick fixes.
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Post by Cast no shadow on Jun 28, 2016 16:08:23 GMT
A Pulis England XI Hart Stones Shawcross Smalling Jones Welbeck Dier Drinkwater Townsend Carroll Kane No shotton?
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Post by iplayinthehole on Jun 28, 2016 16:14:16 GMT
Sorry mate, but that's utter, utter nonsense. Tournament football is not the same as club football. Nothing like it in terms of player development. We needed a plan last night, along with the gumption, willingness and guile to execute it. I saw no plan, just a shoehorned team of the 'best players'. Quite rightly we got beat, like Arse did when they arrogantly assumed we would roll over on our own patch. At least Pulis would prepare the team and have a plan, even if it wasn't to your personal tastes. Personally my choice would be Rafa. He knows England, many of the players, and is an excellent cup competition manager with a proven track record, which is everything you need. I'm not sure I've made my point clear. One of the biggest problems with England, whoever the manager is, is that we don't produce players with either the football brain or technical ability to be successful at international level. If we're going to start producing them, at any level, surely we need someone in charge at the very top of the game who believes in those same qualities, rather than ignoring them in favour of lumping a big diagonal to the big man. Would he have beaten Iceland? Yeah, almost certainly. But is that literally all we're asking for? The 'plan' he'd have had doesn't suit the best players we have at our disposal. Again, unless you're happy to ignore the Delle Allis, Luke Shaws and Rashfords in the world in favour of the Andy Carrolls. Would he of ignored those players and played a big centre forward and wingers throughout the tournament? Maybe, but in fairness Hodgson's team in the second half in particular, played plenty of long ball football. Not easy on the eye and even less effective without a clear plan. For me the issue is a continued over emphasis on the 'best players'. That saw Kane up front and Rooney and Vardy on the pitch and Sturridge, each playing God knows where, with no clear service. Net result? Good footballers creating no clear cut chances. Players should fit a system and a plan. We are learning nothing and lack the balls to make a bold decision on that. History is just repeating, just like the Gerrard/Lampard days.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 16:17:40 GMT
I'm not sure I've made my point clear. One of the biggest problems with England, whoever the manager is, is that we don't produce players with either the football brain or technical ability to be successful at international level. If we're going to start producing them, at any level, surely we need someone in charge at the very top of the game who believes in those same qualities, rather than ignoring them in favour of lumping a big diagonal to the big man. Would he have beaten Iceland? Yeah, almost certainly. But is that literally all we're asking for? The 'plan' he'd have had doesn't suit the best players we have at our disposal. Again, unless you're happy to ignore the Delle Allis, Luke Shaws and Rashfords in the world in favour of the Andy Carrolls. Would he of ignored those players and played a big centre forward and wingers throughout the tournament? Maybe, but in fairness Hodgson's team in the second half in particular, played plenty of long ball football. Not easy on the eye and even less effective without a clear plan. For me the issue is a continued over emphasis on the 'best players'. That saw Kane up front and Rooney and Vardy on the pitch and Sturridge, each playing God knows where, with no clear service. Net result? Good footballers creating no clear cut chances. Players should fit a system and a plan. We are learning nothing and lack the balls to make a bold decision on that. History is just repeating, just like the Gerrard/Lampard days. You seem to be suggesting I thought we did have a plan last night or in the tournament, which I'm 100% not doing. There's no defending that whatsoever. I agree players should fit a system. But we have talented players and we need a manager who'd get the best out of them, not restrict them to the basics. I just think it's a bit weird that people are moaning about a lack of chances created and square pegs in round holes and then saying Pulis is the man for the job.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Jun 28, 2016 16:22:09 GMT
A Pulis England XI Hart Stones Shawcross Smalling Jones Welbeck Dier Drinkwater Townsend Carroll Kane I've just come.
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Post by iplayinthehole on Jun 28, 2016 16:34:47 GMT
Would he of ignored those players and played a big centre forward and wingers throughout the tournament? Maybe, but in fairness Hodgson's team in the second half in particular, played plenty of long ball football. Not easy on the eye and even less effective without a clear plan. For me the issue is a continued over emphasis on the 'best players'. That saw Kane up front and Rooney and Vardy on the pitch and Sturridge, each playing God knows where, with no clear service. Net result? Good footballers creating no clear cut chances. Players should fit a system and a plan. We are learning nothing and lack the balls to make a bold decision on that. History is just repeating, just like the Gerrard/Lampard days. You seem to be suggesting I thought we did have a plan last night or in the tournament, which I'm 100% not doing. There's no defending that whatsoever. I agree players should fit a system. But we have talented players and we need a manager who'd get the best out of them, not restrict them to the basics. I just think it's a bit weird that people are moaning about a lack of chances created and square pegs in round holes and then saying Pulis is the man for the job. Of course - not suggesting you were defending that shower - though those WERE technically good players losing to a vastly inferior team who did have a plan and not much else. I'm simply pointing out that for all his faults, at least TP did have a clear idea about how he wanted his teams to play. Just for the record I didn't like TP's football at all, but I do recognise that he had the courage of his convictions. Just need to avoid blanket prejudices around the 'play the right way' bollocks.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 17:06:55 GMT
You seem to be suggesting I thought we did have a plan last night or in the tournament, which I'm 100% not doing. There's no defending that whatsoever. I agree players should fit a system. But we have talented players and we need a manager who'd get the best out of them, not restrict them to the basics. I just think it's a bit weird that people are moaning about a lack of chances created and square pegs in round holes and then saying Pulis is the man for the job. Of course - not suggesting you were defending that shower - though those WERE technically good players losing to a vastly inferior team who did have a plan and not much else. I'm simply pointing out that for all his faults, at least TP did have a clear idea about how he wanted his teams to play. Just for the record I didn't like TP's football at all, but I do recognise that he had the courage of his convictions. Just need to avoid blanket prejudices around the 'play the right way' bollocks. It's not a play the right way thing at all - it's about a manager who can get something out of your best players. I haven't really seen anyone on the list who fits the bill though. The fact that Glenn Hoddle has somehow transformed into this mythical genius rather than a bloke who upset his players and said some utterly mental stuff about the disabled - and talks rotten pish on the television - shows how utterly desperate we are.
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Post by upthefud on Jun 28, 2016 17:17:12 GMT
I'd take Pulis in a heartbeat and think he'd do an excellent job. Get the most out of an average group.
Hart
Walker (Long throws) Shawcross Jagielka Rose
Welbeck/Lallana/Milner Drinkwater Dier Zaha/Townsend
Carroll/Kane
Vardy/Sturridge
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Post by chiefdelilah on Jun 28, 2016 17:21:28 GMT
I'd take Pulis in a heartbeat and think he'd do an excellent job. Get the most out of an average group. Hart Walker (Long throws) Shawcross Jagielka Rose Welbeck/Lallana/Milner Drinkwater Dier Zaha/Townsend Carroll/Kane Vardy/Sturridge He wouldn't play Walker and Rose in a million years.
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Post by metalhead on Jun 28, 2016 17:23:07 GMT
Tony Pulis would do a far better job than Hodgson, Southgate and most the other jokers being lined up.
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Post by upthefud on Jun 28, 2016 17:34:42 GMT
I'd take Pulis in a heartbeat and think he'd do an excellent job. Get the most out of an average group. Hart Walker (Long throws) Shawcross Jagielka Rose Welbeck/Lallana/Milner Drinkwater Dier Zaha/Townsend Carroll/Kane Vardy/Sturridge He wouldn't play Walker and Rose in a million years. Like Andy Griffin would never play for us?
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Post by Pugsley on Jun 28, 2016 17:42:45 GMT
What a crackpot debate.
He'd literally shat his shell suit at the thought of managing England.
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