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Post by cousindupree on May 4, 2016 9:24:44 GMT
It seems that Imbula Shaq Muni Diouf and now Bojan all need a 'good pre-season' which will transform them according to some sages on here. What constitutes 'a good pre-season' and its suggested it will cure most players lack of form in the back half of the season, the players are trained and coached right through the season....its a genuine question Mark Hughes last pre-season presided over a winless run that stretched almost into October. Was that a good pre-season?
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2016 9:27:15 GMT
I think people are eluding to the 2/3 week fitness training (usually at high altitude) players get in pre-season. This is supposed to stand them in good stead for the upcoming season, rather than the results which don't really mean a thing.
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Post by roostershair on May 4, 2016 9:49:12 GMT
A weeks caravan holiday in Prestatyn
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Post by supersimonstainrod on May 4, 2016 9:51:49 GMT
A weeks caravan holiday in Prestatyn Make it a fortnight and we'll be doing a Leicester next season....
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Post by JoeinOz on May 4, 2016 9:52:24 GMT
Unless you have had a full pre season fitness regime preferably with the same club you will be playing for it can hinder a player's season for a variety of reasons. Pre season also is the best time to develop styles and systems of play because the squad is together without the pressure of competitive games.
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Post by Gods on May 4, 2016 10:11:05 GMT
I hope we play a bit better this pre-season than we did last.
We could hardly buy a goal and it all culminated in that horrible 2-0 defeat at Brentford.
We took that desperate form and low key approach in to the season proper and garnered just 3 points from the first possible 18.
I think in the latter stages of pre-season you need to stretch your legs a little bit and try and produce something meaningful.
I mean Federer would not dream of going toe to toe with Djokovic having barely hit a ball in anger for 3 months, it would just be ridiculous.
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Post by metalhead on May 4, 2016 13:15:41 GMT
I hope we play a bit better this pre-season than we did last. We could hardly buy a goal and it all culminated in that horrible 2-0 defeat at Brentford. We took that desperate form and low key approach in to the season proper and garnered just 3 points from the first possible 18. I think in the latter stages of pre-season you need to stretch your legs a little bit and try and produce something meaningful. I mean Federer would not dream of going toe to toe with Djokovic having barely hit a ball in anger for 3 months, it would just be ridiculous. We were hopeless in Cologne as well. I mean the first game, we really gave them a go and were unlucky, Johnson was unfit and gave a daft peno, but that second game against Porto was horrible. They destroyed us, with Imbula in midfield lol. That said, Singapore was a different matter. We gave Everton a really good game and were a tad unlucky not to win that.
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Post by jezzascfc on May 4, 2016 13:28:26 GMT
The hard yards of fitness work are done pre-season. If a player misses this due to injury or moving clubs, it can mean he is behind the others and may even mean he is more susceptible to injury as he pushes himself hard in the season without this foundation. It also helps to form tactics in the manager's mind in friendlies, where there is less pressure to get a result and can assist in team bonding on the trips away.
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2016 13:41:47 GMT
I hope we play a bit better this pre-season than we did last. We could hardly buy a goal and it all culminated in that horrible 2-0 defeat at Brentford. We took that desperate form and low key approach in to the season proper and garnered just 3 points from the first possible 18. I think in the latter stages of pre-season you need to stretch your legs a little bit and try and produce something meaningful. I mean Federer would not dream of going toe to toe with Djokovic having barely hit a ball in anger for 3 months, it would just be ridiculous. We were hopeless in Cologne as well. I mean the first game, we really gave them a go and were unlucky, Johnson was unfit and gave a daft peno, but that second game against Porto was horrible. They destroyed us, with Imbula in midfield lol. That said, Singapore was a different matter. We gave Everton a really good game and were a tad unlucky not to win that. +1
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Post by lawrieleslie on May 4, 2016 13:44:40 GMT
A weeks caravan holiday in Prestatyn Make it a fortnight and we'll be doing a Leicester next season.... It didn't help Evans though did it?
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Post by harryburrows on May 4, 2016 15:54:23 GMT
Unless you have had a full pre season fitness regime preferably with the same club you will be playing for it can hinder a player's season for a variety of reasons. Pre season also is the best time to develop styles and systems of play because the squad is together without the pressure of competitive games. Sorry joe you're waffling
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2016 15:56:23 GMT
Travelling halfway across the globe to Singapore, back again and then onto Germany didn't help. With travel, rest and recovery we must have missed at least a weeks worth of training...if not more.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on May 4, 2016 16:23:28 GMT
Don't we do it differently to most other clubs? The Rodan approach. We don't 'front load' fitness with intense pre seasons. We build fitness incrementally through the season. January pick me up in Dubai as a booost for a strong finish.
The injuries we've suffered would knacker any plan.
Not sure how the Euros will impact on our preseason plans, and there'll always be commercial considerations {eg the Singapore Tour.} I'd have thought there'll need to be individual approaches. Whelan, Walters, Arnie and Shaq should perhaps just be kept ticking over afterwards, nowt too demanding. Adam, Imbula, Joselu treated more vigorously throughout pre season.. And of course friendlies. Hopefully we'll get business sorted before the season starts.
I thought the issue with Bojan was that he did 'too much' in the closed season, he apparently worked through it to get back up to speed. A feeling that he may have 'shot his bolt' for this season, partly as a result of that.
I thought the core of the squad: Pieters, Cameron, Arnie, Whelan, Diouf- those players who Hughes had had a couple of years to work with looked in great condition at the beginning of the season. It was the new recruits: Johnson, Afellay, Shaq and Jos - who needed to get up to speed. I began to see some the logic in our 'incremental' approach over the long term. Nevertheless it ended up being a sluggish start. Par for the course. The minutiae and marginal stuff is important in football, so hopefully we'll continually tweak and improve our methods.
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Post by ashleyscfc on May 4, 2016 16:25:14 GMT
Travelling halfway across the globe to Singapore, back again and then onto Germany didn't help. With travel, rest and recovery we must have missed at least a weeks worth of training...if not more. this....shocking management
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Post by ohbottom on May 4, 2016 16:29:58 GMT
I think people are eluding to the 2/3 week fitness training (usually at high altitude) players get in pre-season. This is supposed to stand them in good stead for the upcoming season, rather than the results which don't really mean a thing. I admit I sometimes struggle to comprehend the modern way of doing things, so call me a daft old-fashioned dinosaur if you like, but I still think results are actually quite important.
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Post by leicspotter on May 4, 2016 18:20:14 GMT
just buy one of those Cryo wotsits like Leicester have
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Post by ChesterStokie on May 4, 2016 18:34:51 GMT
Travelling halfway across the globe to Singapore, back again and then onto Germany didn't help. With travel, rest and recovery we must have missed at least a weeks worth of training...if not more. I went to Cologne and believe me it was a much easier journey than my drive to Manchester every morning.
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Post by luke45 on May 4, 2016 18:35:00 GMT
You only have to look at Chelsea's decline this season to see how important a good pre season actually is. I don't doubt there was several other reasons behind their decline this season but poor pre season preparation was definitely one of them. They returned to training later than everyone else, they played only three games before a Wembley Community Shield final and only four before the season started. They lost all of those pre season games, lost at Wembley and then won only one of their opening five league games, losing three. I don't care how relevant the result of a friendly is, winning games breeds confidence and when you are going into a new season on the back of four straight defeats morale is nowhere near as high as it should be.
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Post by JoeinOz on May 4, 2016 22:27:28 GMT
Unless you have had a full pre season fitness regime preferably with the same club you will be playing for it can hinder a player's season for a variety of reasons. Pre season also is the best time to develop styles and systems of play because the squad is together without the pressure of competitive games. Sorry joe you're waffling That's not waffling at all. I made legitimate points about why pre season is important for a player. Why is that waffling?
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Post by PB1863 on May 4, 2016 22:36:12 GMT
You only have to look at Chelsea's decline this season to see how important a good pre season actually is. I don't doubt there was several other reasons behind their decline this season but poor pre season preparation was definitely one of them. They returned to training later than everyone else, they played only three games before a Wembley Community Shield final and only four before the season started. They lost all of those pre season games, lost at Wembley and then won only one of their opening five league games, losing three. I don't care how relevant the result of a friendly is, winning games breeds confidence and when you are going into a new season on the back of four straight defeats morale is nowhere near as high as it should be. Chelsea played an exhibition game in Sydney so I agree with your comments. Excellent marketing and PR but didn't help their start to the season. I have worked for sporting clubs and the strength and conditioning teams work on a high intensity fitness program pre season and then a maintenance program throughout the season.
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Post by JoeinOz on May 4, 2016 22:41:23 GMT
You only have to look at Chelsea's decline this season to see how important a good pre season actually is. I don't doubt there was several other reasons behind their decline this season but poor pre season preparation was definitely one of them. They returned to training later than everyone else, they played only three games before a Wembley Community Shield final and only four before the season started. They lost all of those pre season games, lost at Wembley and then won only one of their opening five league games, losing three. I don't care how relevant the result of a friendly is, winning games breeds confidence and when you are going into a new season on the back of four straight defeats morale is nowhere near as high as it should be. Chelsea played an exhibition game in Sydney so I agree with your comments. Excellent marketing and PR but didn't help their start to the season. I have worked for sporting clubs and the strength and conditioning teams work on a high intensity fitness program pre season and then a maintenance program throughout the season. Is pre season crucial for fitness levels? ?
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Post by davejohnno1 on May 4, 2016 22:53:07 GMT
pre season is hugely important and shouldn't be underestimated.
Every player that has struggled with fitness issues this season was blighted by problems in pre-season. It isn't a coincidence. Those that have struggled for form for the most part were those that had no pre-season at all. Shaqiri and Bojan being prime examples.
Those that had a full and uninterrupted pre-season have pretty much been our best and most consistent performers...Butland, Whelan and most importantly Arnie who completed a full pre-season for the first time of his spell with us.
That foundation is crucial and underpins a clubs whole season in many respects.
The results don't matter but we really do need our squad to come through a full pre-season schedule fit and healthy. Then and only then, will we see our squad remain in some kind of tact as the season progresses.
Much of Chelsea's poor form was attributed to the lack of a proper pre-season where they returned about 10 days later than normal. Many say that was a massive part of Mourinho's dismissal. The players were "undercooked" and simply couldn't perform at levels that they had been used to. They haven't been able to recover all season long.
For a professional football, pre-season is of huge importance.
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Post by PB1863 on May 4, 2016 23:05:04 GMT
pre season is hugely important and shouldn't be underestimated. Every player that has struggled with fitness issues this season was blighted by problems in pre-season. It isn't a coincidence. Those that have struggled for form for the most part were those that had no pre-season at all. Shaqiri and Bojan being prime examples. Those that had a full and uninterrupted pre-season have pretty much been our best and most consistent performers...Butland, Whelan and most importantly Arnie who completed a full pre-season for the first time of his spell with us. That foundation is crucial and underpins a clubs whole season in many respects. The results don't matter but we really do need our squad to come through a full pre-season schedule fit and healthy. Then and only then, will we see our squad remain in some kind of tact as the season progresses. Much of Chelsea's poor form was attributed to the lack of a proper pre-season where they returned about 10 days later than normal. Many say that was a massive part of Mourinho's dismissal. The players were "undercooked" and simply couldn't perform at levels that they had been used to. They haven't been able to recover all season long. For a professional football, pre-season is of huge importance. Agreed. If you aren't fit you are playing catch up and can end up with niggling injuries. Pre season games are there to increase fitness but to also give the fringe/young players a go and test formations.
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Post by PB1863 on May 4, 2016 23:06:42 GMT
Sorry didn't mean to crash your post. My comments have somehow been added to your post. Apologies.
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Post by davejohnno1 on May 4, 2016 23:16:37 GMT
Sorry didn't mean to crash your post. My comments have somehow been added to your post. Apologies. No need to apologise. You've added some sense to my inane ramblings
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Post by kustokie on May 4, 2016 23:57:26 GMT
Don't we do it differently to most other clubs? The Rodan approach. We don't 'front load' fitness with intense pre seasons. We build fitness incrementally through the season. January pick me up in Dubai as a booost for a strong finish. The injuries we've suffered would knacker any plan. Not sure how the Euros will impact on our preseason plans, and there'll always be commercial considerations {eg the Singapore Tour.} I'd have thought there'll need to be individual approaches. Whelan, Walters, Arnie and Shaq should perhaps just be kept ticking over afterwards, nowt too demanding. Adam, Imbula, Joselu treated more vigorously throughout pre season.. And of course friendlies. Hopefully we'll get business sorted before the season starts. I thought the issue with Bojan was that he did 'too much' in the closed season, he apparently worked through it to get back up to speed. A feeling that he may have 'shot his bolt' for this season, partly as a result of that. I thought the core of the squad: Pieters, Cameron, Arnie, Whelan, Diouf- those players who Hughes had had a couple of years to work with looked in great condition at the beginning of the season. It was the new recruits: Johnson, Afellay, Shaq and Jos - who needed to get up to speed. I began to see some the logic in our 'incremental' approach over the long term. Nevertheless it ended up being a sluggish start. Par for the course. The minutiae and marginal stuff is important in football, so hopefully we'll continually tweak and improve our methods. Other clubs go to high altitude to increase red blood cell counts and oxygen carrying capacity. Where does Stoke go. Dubai and Singapore (both sea leveL)!
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Post by cheeesfreeex on May 5, 2016 0:02:43 GMT
Don't we do it differently to most other clubs? The Rodan approach. We don't 'front load' fitness with intense pre seasons. We build fitness incrementally through the season. January pick me up in Dubai as a booost for a strong finish. The injuries we've suffered would knacker any plan. Not sure how the Euros will impact on our preseason plans, and there'll always be commercial considerations {eg the Singapore Tour.} I'd have thought there'll need to be individual approaches. Whelan, Walters, Arnie and Shaq should perhaps just be kept ticking over afterwards, nowt too demanding. Adam, Imbula, Joselu treated more vigorously throughout pre season.. And of course friendlies. Hopefully we'll get business sorted before the season starts. I thought the issue with Bojan was that he did 'too much' in the closed season, he apparently worked through it to get back up to speed. A feeling that he may have 'shot his bolt' for this season, partly as a result of that. I thought the core of the squad: Pieters, Cameron, Arnie, Whelan, Diouf- those players who Hughes had had a couple of years to work with looked in great condition at the beginning of the season. It was the new recruits: Johnson, Afellay, Shaq and Jos - who needed to get up to speed. I began to see some the logic in our 'incremental' approach over the long term. Nevertheless it ended up being a sluggish start. Par for the course. The minutiae and marginal stuff is important in football, so hopefully we'll continually tweak and improve our methods. Other clubs go to high altitude to increase red blood cell counts and oxygen carrying capacity. Where does Stoke go. Dubai and Singapore (both sea leveL)! Interesting thought. Do you know much about our Rodan stuff? I'd love to understand it better.
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Post by kustokie on May 5, 2016 0:08:34 GMT
Other clubs go to high altitude to increase red blood cell counts and oxygen carrying capacity. Where does Stoke go. Dubai and Singapore (both sea leveL)! Interesting thought. Do you know much about our Rodan stuff? I'd love to understand it better. Nope. What is it?
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Post by chrispk76 on May 5, 2016 4:21:20 GMT
Travelling halfway across the globe to Singapore, back again and then onto Germany didn't help. With travel, rest and recovery we must have missed at least a weeks worth of training...if not more. Arsenal and Everton were involved in Singapore and both their managers are having their jobs questioned . Makes you wonder if the competition is worth it
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Post by chrispk76 on May 5, 2016 10:25:28 GMT
Speaking of which has there been any rumours about the pre season plans yet ? given the record of the Singapore participants I hope we are giving it a wide berth
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