|
|
Post by reggio27 on Aug 2, 2015 19:00:48 GMT
Alright everyone. I'm not one to write on here as generally I prefer to sit back and watch everyone else get on with it. There are a couple of things I wouldn't mind putting out there.
Now the last two games have obviously not thrown up the results everyone would have wanted; however it is pre season and previous experience tells us that they don't have much baring on the season. They have displayed something that does worry me slightly and that is genuine leadership when Shawcross is missing.
What we've had the last few seasons is a great core to the side. Begovic (despite not having a great season) was experienced and worked well with Shawcross when marshaling the defence. Shawcross, as we know is a great organiser. Nzonzi who, no matter what people say, will be missed hugely. I've not seen many players at Stoke make things look so easy and create so much time for himself on the ball.
We could go into the first game of the season with 2 gone and one who is looking increasingly injury prone. I think any team in the country would struggle if you took 3 players out of the middle of the side and it does worry me that the club underestimate the collective impact these have had. There is no doubt that we've replaced them with players of great potential and you have to give them a chance but in Butland and probably Van Ginkel we've got ones who are young and inexperienced in an unforgiving league.
I guess what concerns me is who is going to step up to the plate and be that leader of the pitch and should we have replaced those gone (including Huth whose influence within the squad shouldn't be underestimated) with players with a bit more experience?
|
|
|
|
Post by StokieNath on Aug 2, 2015 19:04:06 GMT
A decent read.
But we do need a proper Nzonzi replacement urgently.
|
|
|
|
Post by scfcno1fan on Aug 2, 2015 19:04:53 GMT
Spine of the side gone, but another key word for me is identity.
Do we currently have one?
Are the players we have signed up for the task of fighting for the shirt?
I'm really not sure.
Only time will tell.
|
|
|
|
Post by skip on Aug 2, 2015 19:08:23 GMT
Identity and commitment to the shirt are different though aren't they. Hughes is building a new side and that requires time to gel and flourish. The players are professional and will know they're in a transitional stage but because of this, absolutely I agree, the Whelans of this world, even the like of GCam need to stick their chins out and be leaders.
|
|
|
|
Post by malteser68 on Aug 2, 2015 21:21:56 GMT
A decent read. But we do need a proper Nzonzi replacement urgently. Problem is - there isn't one! i know no other player with his abilities and physicality in such a sensitive posit ion unless of course you're looking at the Vidals of this world which are way beyond our league |
|
|
|
Post by StokieNath on Aug 2, 2015 21:25:09 GMT
A decent read. But we do need a proper Nzonzi replacement urgently. Problem is - there isn't one! i know no other player with his abilities and physicality in such a sensitive posit ion unless of course you're looking at the Vidals of this world which are way beyond our league I was thinking more of players like John Obi Mikel or Cheik Tiote or even Leroy Fer I think they would be decent players to fulfil the nzonzi role. |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 2, 2015 21:27:25 GMT
If this was another side we'd be laughing our tits off.
We've lost the hardcore spine of our side and replaced them with a capable youngster, Phillip Wollscheid and a potentially capable youngster.
I've been worried for a while but I don't know how even the most positive person out there can't be the slightest worried about that.
|
|
|
|
Post by pottermouth on Aug 2, 2015 21:28:15 GMT
Spine of the side gone, but another key word for me is identity. Do we currently have one? Are the players we have signed up for the task of fighting for the shirt? I'm really not sure. Only time will tell. Well it sounds Shawcross's spine may have gone...I have said previously, this close season has been disappointing. However, in Mark we trust. Be interesting to see if heads drop if we have to grind out results. In fact, could we grind out results with the new signings we have? |
|
|
|
Post by StokieNath on Aug 2, 2015 21:29:47 GMT
Only time will tell
|
|
|
|
Post by st4scfc on Aug 2, 2015 22:07:22 GMT
If this was another side we'd be laughing our tits off. We've lost the hardcore spine of our side and replaced them with a capable youngster, Phillip Wollscheid and a potentially capable youngster. I've been worried for a while but I don't know how even the most positive person out there can't be the slightest worried about that. who do you think has identified these signings, are these hughes' identified first and second choice targets or club ' alternatives', i myself find it hard to believe that hughes would of chosen these players to move the club on? |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 2, 2015 22:10:11 GMT
If this was another side we'd be laughing our tits off. We've lost the hardcore spine of our side and replaced them with a capable youngster, Phillip Wollscheid and a potentially capable youngster. I've been worried for a while but I don't know how even the most positive person out there can't be the slightest worried about that. who do you think has identified these signings, are these hughes' identified first and second choice targets or club ' alternatives', i myself find it hard to believe that hughes would of chosen these players to move the club on? Hughes has the last word on signings I'd imagine, he knows the budget and he will sign players who fit that budget. |
|
|
|
Post by st4scfc on Aug 2, 2015 22:18:17 GMT
who do you think has identified these signings, are these hughes' identified first and second choice targets or club ' alternatives', i myself find it hard to believe that hughes would of chosen these players to move the club on? Hughes has the last word on signings I'd imagine, he knows the budget and he will sign players who fit that budget. i can only assume going off the cost of what we have bought in then so far that we are going to be active for some serious quality by the end of the window. If we arnt then hughes has been shafted in my opinion. |
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 2, 2015 22:20:38 GMT
Hughes has the last word on signings I'd imagine, he knows the budget and he will sign players who fit that budget. i can only assume going off the cost of what we have bought in then so far that we are going to be active for some serious quality by the end of the window. If we arnt then hughes has been shafted in my opinion. I would tend to agree..... |
|
|
|
Post by malteser68 on Aug 3, 2015 4:33:14 GMT
Problem is - there isn't one! i know no other player with his abilities and physicality in such a sensitive posit ion unless of course you're looking at the Vidals of this world which are way beyond our league I was thinking more of players like John Obi Mikel or Cheik Tiote or even Leroy Fer I think they would be decent players to fulfil the nzonzi role. the 3 players you mention, whilst being decent replacements, are nowhere near as good as nzonzi. That's the magnitude of the loss we suffered with his departure. And yet if someone airs his concern here Pwingy the Self-styled Enforcer will be quick to label him as a retard and knicker-wetter |
|
|
|
Post by benjaminbiscuit on Aug 3, 2015 6:46:12 GMT
Wouldn't be a huge surprise To lose the first three games and who knows with WBA.Our guardian chortling little bird is struggling at the moment in the new big world he has thrust himself into, really dont see us punching above our weight in that situation on the last day of august when actually we could have played those games with Nzonzi and Bego in the group rather than £15 million in the bank that Never kicked a ball in it's life .
Funny chirpy never mentioned selling our best assets without securing proven replacements in his little public masturbation at the weekend , no mention of sold our best players , replaced them on the cheap , negative investment In the squad , turned down by our major targets publicly because our media strategy is woeful , embarking on , selling the obvious replacement for our clearly injured skipper .
We have totally outgrown our off the field capability and it needs sorting otherwise one way or the other it will end in tears on or off the field mad probably both .oh and its not June , or July it's august 5 days before the season starts and a number of us having been saying this for 3 months now 6 in my case when I first doubted the big" wait for the summer rhetoric" when Lennon said thanks bit no thanks
Actually internally I think it's known we have made a total and utter bollocks of the summer and the chortling was a very ill judged attempt at deflection , the mood around the summer Is actually potentially quite ugly with a bad start , but knowing it and having the capability( the issue from the start ) to do something about it are very different .
|
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Aug 3, 2015 11:40:18 GMT
Wouldn't be a huge surprise To lose the first three games and who knows with WBA.Our guardian chortling little bird is struggling at the moment in the new big world he has thrust himself into, really dont see us punching above our weight in that situation on the last day of august when actually we could have played those games with Nzonzi and Bego in the group rather than £15 million in the bank that Never kicked a ball in it's life . Funny chirpy never mentioned selling our best assets without securing proven replacements in his little public masturbation at the weekend , no mention of sold our best players , replaced them on the cheap , negative investment In the squad , turned down by our major targets publicly because our media strategy is woeful , embarking on , selling the obvious replacement for our clearly injured skipper . We have totally outgrown our off the field capability and it needs sorting otherwise one way or the other it will end in tears on or off the field mad probably both .oh and its not June , or July it's august 5 days before the season starts and a number of us having been saying this for 3 months now 6 in my case when I first doubted the big" wait for the summer rhetoric" when Lennon said thanks bit no thanks Actually internally I think it's known we have made a total and utter bollocks of the summer and the chortling was a very ill judged attempt at deflection , the mood around the summer Is actually potentially quite ugly with a bad start , but knowing it and having the capability( the issue from the start ) to do something about it are very different . Just stop it. |
|
|
|
Post by Pretty Little Boother on Aug 3, 2015 12:02:18 GMT
What have the club done since Coates' return to suggest that we're underestimating the spine of the side?
They know more then you, me, or any other fan because it's their fucking job; if the manager believes that Van Ginkel and Butland are adequate replacements I have absolutely zero reason to doubt them. He sees them every day in training, he's experienced and talented as a manager.
I do doubt, however, that anyone on his board has seen Butland in more than probably 30 games over his career or, for Van Ginkel, probably half that.
This is a manager who's taken Muniesa, Pieters, Arnautovic, Bojan and Diouf from abroad having either never played in England before, or flopped in the case of Diouf, and guided them towards their standards as top-half Premier League players. Butland and Van Ginkel are more experienced in the Prem than any of those (Diouf excluded), so have a bit of fucking faith in Sparky for Christ's sake, he hasn't let you down yet.
I understand the worry over Shawcrows but it's an injury, injuries happen. We've got short term cover and if, heaven forbid, we need long term cover; there's a month of the window left.
|
|
|
|
Post by FullerMagic on Aug 5, 2015 9:05:46 GMT
It's quite funny that Fleet Street are choosing this pre-season to blow smoke up our arses and semi-seriously predicting a crack at the top 7. And yet it's this season where the absence of the Holy Trinity of Begovic-Shawcross-Nzonzi, that everything's been built on, is really to going to show what we've got. If Hughes navigates this and repeats what he's done in the last 2 years, I think he deserves quite a big medal! Good piece by Homzy on teamtalk |
|
|
|
Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 5, 2015 11:16:33 GMT
It's quite funny that Fleet Street are choosing this pre-season to blow smoke up our arses and semi-seriously predicting a crack at the top 7. And yet it's this season where the absence of the Holy Trinity of Begovic-Shawcross-Nzonzi, that everything's been built on, is really to going to show what we've got. If Hughes navigates this and repeats what he's done in the last 2 years, I think he deserves quite a big medal! Good piece by Homzy on teamtalkAt the opposite end of the scale we've lost a goalkeeper who cost us more points than he saved us and we've lost a midfielder who wasn't good defensively, rarely created a goal and generally scored around 2 per season. Shawcross, if rumour and conjecture is true, is the biggest loss of the 3 by some distance and is a serious concern should it be long term Edit - with the current absence of a direct replacement I'm more concerned by the loss of Moses than I am with that of begovic, particularly with injury worries for Arnie ahead of Sunday |
|
