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Post by wagstand on Dec 19, 2014 5:48:45 GMT
I don't know why the club are stalling over extending the stadium. I have tried to buy 2 seats together for various games this season and it is not possible . Just tried again for Chelsea and west brom games, no chance. On top of that Utd match is sold out. I know I left it late but lots of people can't plan too far in front due to work commitments and stuff. What the hell are they waiting for ? A downturn in performances or relegation so they won't have to bother. Strike while the iron is hot!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 7:07:57 GMT
I thought it had been at least a week since this debate! Joking aside though I fully agree with you, got to build the fan base from here and a couple of thousand seats shouldn't be difficult to fill if priced/marketed correctly by the club.
I believe there's only a 100 seats for Chelsea left and around 300 for the Baggies...
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Dec 19, 2014 7:13:18 GMT
I rather suspect that they will finally fill in the scoreboard corner next summer - the planning permission they obtained 2 years ago is still live.
It was an unfortunate coincidence that when the planning permission was applied for we followed it up with our lowest attendances since we joined the Prem. We now have 2 seasons of increased attendances so the case for NOT building that corner is difficult to argue.
They are not going to do much of the work during the season - they'll want to do the bulk of the work when the stadium is empty so you'll have to be patient and wait for the summer - if I am right.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 8:38:38 GMT
When you look at Molyneaux...30 odd miles away and the ambitious ground expansion there..it puts our shameful attitude into perspective.At Stoke every home game this season in the Prem has attracted 27,000 plus. It is very difficult to sell the last few hundred seats because they are the most expensive with the worst views.
We could easily fill 30,000 seats for.most games. The Club really need to look forward, stop being so super cautious and have a good look at what Wolves are doing...a Championship Club !!!
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 8:41:53 GMT
I rather suspect that they will finally fill in the scoreboard corner next summer - the planning permission they obtained 2 years ago is still live. It was an unfortunate coincidence that when the planning permission was applied for we followed it up with our lowest attendances since we joined the Prem. We now have 2 seasons of increased attendances so the case for NOT building that corner is difficult to argue. They are not going to do much of the work during the season - they'll want to do the bulk of the work when the stadium is empty so you'll have to be patient and wait for the summer - if I am right. 'Unfortunate experience' or 'Same old Story' :-(
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Post by stokiesteve on Dec 19, 2014 8:42:07 GMT
When you look at Molyneaux...30 odd miles away and the ambitious ground expansion there..it puts our shameful attitude into perspective.At Stoke every home game this season in the Prem has attracted 27,000 plus. It is very difficult to sell the last few hundred seats because they are the most expensive with the worst views. We could easily fill 30,000 seats for.most games. The Club really need to look forward, stop being so super cautious and have a good look at what Wolves are doing...a Championship Club !!! I don't agree with Wolves as a yardstick. They spent a lot of money on the stadium before securing premiership stability. They now have a large empty stadium and lots of spent cash.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 8:44:11 GMT
When you look at Molyneaux...30 odd miles away and the ambitious ground expansion there..it puts our shameful attitude into perspective.At Stoke every home game this season in the Prem has attracted 27,000 plus. It is very difficult to sell the last few hundred seats because they are the most expensive with the worst views. We could easily fill 30,000 seats for.most games. The Club really need to look forward, stop being so super cautious and have a good look at what Wolves are doing...a Championship Club !!! I don't agree with Wolves as a yardstick. They spent a lot of money on the stadium before securing premiership stability. They now have a large empty stadium and lots of spent cash. That's not the point.
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Post by lordb on Dec 19, 2014 8:50:35 GMT
When you look at Molyneaux...30 odd miles away and the ambitious ground expansion there..it puts our shameful attitude into perspective.At Stoke every home game this season in the Prem has attracted 27,000 plus. It is very difficult to sell the last few hundred seats because they are the most expensive with the worst views. We could easily fill 30,000 seats for.most games. The Club really need to look forward, stop being so super cautious and have a good look at what Wolves are doing...a Championship Club !!! I don't agree with Wolves as a yardstick. They spent a lot of money on the stadium before securing premiership stability. They now have a large empty stadium and lots of spent cash. It's hardly empty To be fair they did expand too quickly which cost them. Wolves built a whole new stand & we're going to build 2 more. At Stoke we are talking about 1 corner holding less than 2000 & costing about the same as Danny Collins did. Stoke are hardly risking financila ruin by developing that one corner.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 9:03:46 GMT
Wolves are planning for the future..we aren't. I would have thought that point was patently obvious. Hence my comment to Lakeland..'Same old Story'.
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Post by mondeoman on Dec 19, 2014 9:23:14 GMT
Two points, from a purely visual viewpoint I think the Brit' looks poor with open corners, (old fashioned), on TV the other night the MK Dons stadium looked fantastic, a complete bowl, Stoke can't match that ?, footboll stadiums could be like roads, build more capacity and they will fill, (as long as Stoke stay in the premier league). So come on Stoke, DO IT.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2014 10:14:19 GMT
Where's uky?
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Post by nott1 on Dec 19, 2014 10:24:33 GMT
Derby often get better gates than us in a smaller area.
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Post by nott1 on Dec 19, 2014 10:25:29 GMT
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Post by miggo on Dec 19, 2014 10:26:04 GMT
I don't know why the club are stalling over extending the stadium. I have tried to buy 2 seats together for various games this season and it is not possible . Just tried again for Chelsea and west brom games, no chance. On top of that Utd match is sold out. I know I left it late but lots of people can't plan too far in front due to work commitments and stuff. What the hell are they waiting for ? A downturn in performances or relegation so they won't have to bother. Strike while the iron is hot! This season attendances have in general been better, last season against Chelsea there were hundreds of empty seats as there was for United and citeh and I suspect this year's sell out is more to do with the time of year as it seems we struggle to sell out cat A games and at £45 a ticket it's not hard to see why. West Brom will always sell out it does every year as will the cat B and C games due to the cheaper match day prices. Sent from my C6603 using proboards
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Post by StaffordPotter on Dec 19, 2014 10:30:22 GMT
Me and Stafford Stokie attended a meeting around August time with one of the community blokes regarding hanging flags at the Brit (which by the way nothing has happened since). He said the club were planning to fill the corner in at summer 2015 providing we were more or less selling out every home game this season.
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Post by 2004 on Dec 19, 2014 10:30:24 GMT
I agree. It's impossible to get 2 seats together in the current capacity.
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Post by mrcoke on Dec 19, 2014 11:12:34 GMT
Does anyone know when the depreciation on the existing stadium runs out?
It's just possible Stoke are waiting for the investment in the academy to start to bear fruit and then invest in a significant increase in the stadium capacity rather than fiddle about with the corners, which will bring little extra revenue. I'm thinking along the lines of business centre for conferences, hotel, theatre, cinema complex, shopping centre, etc. This would use the car parking area (leave some for disabled/buses), but there is plenty of green area/redundant land within walking distance or park and ride to the south west. Just an idea for people to have a tilt at.
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Post by stokesaint1 on Dec 19, 2014 11:13:37 GMT
Bigger "home" crowds would be fantastic but more empty seats would be horrendeous. Hate it when we play to half empty stadium, viz a viz early cup rounds. That said, traffic wise the Brit can't cope adequately with current attendances, goodness knows what an additional load would do to it.
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Post by stokesaint1 on Dec 19, 2014 11:44:30 GMT
Bigger "home" crowds would be fantastic but more empty seats would be horrendeous. Hate it when we play to half empty stadium, viz a viz early cup rounds. That said, traffic wise the Brit can't cope adequately with current attendances, goodness knows what an additional load would do to it.
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Post by stokiesteve on Dec 19, 2014 11:45:16 GMT
Wolves are planning for the future..we aren't. I would have thought that point was patently obvious. Hence my comment to Lakeland..'Same old Story'. Being ambitious and building up the stadium is one thing. If you don't fill it though what's the point? I agree that the corner project should now go ahead, but I don't see the point in building a massive stadium as Wolves have done if it's not going to be used. You can only plan for the future when you stabilize what you have already achieved, that is CSE business in my view. Some ambition can be impetuous.
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Post by Fenparkpotter on Dec 19, 2014 11:51:35 GMT
Derby often get better gates than us in a smaller area. Derby home attendances are exceptional - but they are a one team city too. No matter how low Vales attendance is, they still have a core 5k football supporters and probably another 10k+ followers who do not attend/pick and choose/go occasionally for cup finals - all from the same city and knocking a fair few thousand off Stoke support.
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Post by roylandstoke on Dec 19, 2014 12:10:30 GMT
Derby often get better gates than us in a smaller area. Derby home attendances are exceptional - but they are a one team city too. No matter how low Vales attendance is, they still have a core 5k football supporters and probably another 10k+ followers who do not attend/pick and choose/go occasionally for cup finals - all from the same city and knocking a fair few thousand off Stoke support. Was just going to type exactly the same. If Vale were in the Prem I'm sure 15,000+ would discover the route to Vale Park. The very existence of Port Vale hinders the success of Stoke City ( the opposite is of course also true). Maybe Coates should buy Vale and close it down. This would save 15,000 souls the misery of continuing to support PVFC and would increase the size of our fan base, allowing us to expand the Brit.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 12:17:21 GMT
Wolves are planning for the future..we aren't. I would have thought that point was patently obvious. Hence my comment to Lakeland..'Same old Story'. Being ambitious and building up the stadium is one thing. If you don't fill it though what's the point? I agree that the corner project should now go ahead, but I don't see the point in building a massive stadium as Wolves have done if it's not going to be used. You can only plan for the future when you stabilize what you have already achieved, that is CSE business in my view. Some ambition can be impetuous. The salient point is; Do we plan for the future or live in the past? 1)A massive stadium can always be filled if you get your pricing policy right? Simple MathsP = Price Q = Quantity R = Revenue So, P x Q = R Reduce price and quantity increases (if elasticity of demand is high which it is at Stoke) 2)Lack of ambition can be lethal. We had 23 years of that before Peter Coates funded our promotion to The Prem via the Loan System. If Coates had not been prepared to risk his money we would not now be in The Prem. Why not now apply this principle to Stadium Expansion and put your faith in the supporters to fill it?
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Post by Robo10 on Dec 19, 2014 12:25:49 GMT
The point on traffic and capacity is very salient
The roads and parking around the ground is almost at a standstill from 2pm until 6pm, so where you think an extra 3-5,000 people will park and get away from the stadium is a mystery - they would have to significantly also invest in transport links and parking to take on many more supporters as regluars each week
A summer boost of 2000 seats would probably be about the max the and the local infrastructure could cope with currently
**HOWEVER**, a train station by the bridge that had services running locally to say Stafford (via Stone), or Congleton (via Kidsgrove) for home fans only (still send the away fans to Stoke station for the major services) would relieve that burden substantially, better coach and bus services / park and ride setup (Christ, even turn the old Vic ground - even just the old training ground / car park into parking options with shuttles to the ground) - just some ideas.....
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Post by wuzza on Dec 19, 2014 12:49:46 GMT
The only argument against expanding the stadium is the infra-structure one but in reality I don't think an extra 3000 people trying to get away will make that much of a difference to a situation that is already beyond horrendous.
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Post by stokiesteve on Dec 19, 2014 12:52:43 GMT
Being ambitious and building up the stadium is one thing. If you don't fill it though what's the point? I agree that the corner project should now go ahead, but I don't see the point in building a massive stadium as Wolves have done if it's not going to be used. You can only plan for the future when you stabilize what you have already achieved, that is CSE business in my view. Some ambition can be impetuous. The salient point is; Do we plan for the future or live in the past? 1)A massive stadium can always be filled if you get your pricing policy right? Simple MathsP = Price Q = Quantity R = Revenue So, P x Q = R Reduce price and quantity increases (if elasticity of demand is high which it is at Stoke) 2)Lack of ambition can be lethal. We had 23 years of that before Peter Coates funded our promotion to The Prem via the Loan System. If Coates had not been prepared to risk his money we would not now be in The Prem. Why not now apply this principle to Stadium Expansion and put your faith in the supporters to fill it? There are far more cases of over ambition being lethal, just look down the leagues.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 19, 2014 12:58:49 GMT
The point on traffic and capacity is very salient The roads and parking around the ground is almost at a standstill from 2pm until 6pm, so where you think an extra 3-5,000 people will park and get away from the stadium is a mystery - they would have to significantly also invest in transport links and parking to take on many more supporters as regluars each week A summer boost of 2000 seats would probably be about the max the and the local infrastructure could cope with currently **HOWEVER**, a train station by the bridge that had services running locally to say Stafford (via Stone), or Congleton (via Kidsgrove) for home fans only (still send the away fans to Stoke station for the major services) would relieve that burden substantially, better coach and bus services / park and ride setup (Christ, even turn the old Vic ground - even just the old training ground / car park into parking options with shuttles to the ground) - just some ideas..... Good point. The infrastructure struggles now with present capacity and may have something to do with stadium expansion...didn't think about that. The problem with the train station idea (one I suggested as The Brit was being built) is that it's an Inter City Line with high speed trains approaching/leaving Stoke Station which, apparently, can't be mucked about with. On the other hand..Ive been to The Vic when we had 45,000 (Liverpool) 42,000 (Man City FA Cup) and cars just parked up a lot further from the ground..so that 'excess capacity' was taken up.
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Post by johnnyboy on Dec 19, 2014 13:07:54 GMT
Why not erect a temporary stand beneath the scoreboard for the rest of the season. Seats would be uncovered so charge say £15-20 - and club would be able gauge the demand for relatively little outlay but benefit from increase gate revenue and associated sales of food, drink, programmes, etc.
Shrewsbury put 2 temporary stands up for their cup match with Chelsea (sponsored by Capital One) as they realised they could fill the extra seats and gain more revenue and potentially new supporters to come back in the future.
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Post by Robo10 on Dec 19, 2014 13:10:32 GMT
Think that was not so bad at the Vic, as it was in town and the ground was fairly easy to get to from everywhere - Hanley parking and you could walk.take a bus, and all the places nearby - Hartshill, Penkhull, Boothen, parking across on the City Road industrial estates, in Stoke itself on the Kings Hall and streets around the town, the official car parks
At the Brit its literally in the middle of nowhere and we dont have the same options - lots of parking opportunities on the industrial estates, but literally one road in and out where the bottlenecks occur
Thankfully they built that bridge over the A50 before we were promoted, else it would have been carnage!
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Post by geoff321 on Dec 19, 2014 13:18:57 GMT
I suppose gates increase depending on results and therefore if The Brit. could hold 35,000 fans could Stoke get near that number?
A statistic that surprised me was that in seven seasons from 1970/71 to 1976/77 the average gate at The Vic was 22,549. The average gate in six seasons from 2008/9 to 2013/14 was 26,821.
A full stadium keeps prices elevated so it's a tricky question as to whether the potential exists for bigger gates in a relatively deprived area.
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