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Post by huddy on Oct 30, 2014 15:12:51 GMT
That 'key component' wasn't on the pitch when we went two nil down.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 6:20:23 GMT
He's a big boy, it comes with the territory. Didn't he turn out for them as well? Yes, but they were making quite a lot of him being a 'skate', from what I could here. For me it was just a case of supporting our player when he was getting stick off the opposition. If the tunnel was on the other side of the ground I wouldn't have bothered. I just don't see the need to coddle them in that scenario. He's not going to be crying into his pillow about it. It's just something that always confuses me, applauding a bloke whose actions could have cost us. Like praising the dog for shitting on your carpet, or fist bumping the driver who's just run in the back of you.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 6:59:22 GMT
The simple reason is the Saints player's got into Mason's head over the non elbow for the first incident, and it obviously played on his mind for the second one.
It's daft to go in to a tackle like that just seconds after the first tackle, right in front of the ref but the ref also has a duty of care for all players. Some of the tackles against were downright reckless.
As for Crouch, once committed into that second tackle there is no pulling out and you are in the lap of the gods to some degree.
If he did pull out or didn't go in to the 50/50 in the first place there would be plenty moaning about his non commitment, including the manager.
Fine margins and sometimes you just cant win.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 12:49:23 GMT
Cost us the match, 2 definite yellow cards and the second gave Mason no alternative but to show him red. Gouranga. Cutting him no slack then?
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Post by onionman on Oct 31, 2014 13:11:07 GMT
Yes, but they were making quite a lot of him being a 'skate', from what I could here. For me it was just a case of supporting our player when he was getting stick off the opposition. If the tunnel was on the other side of the ground I wouldn't have bothered. I just don't see the need to coddle them in that scenario. He's not going to be crying into his pillow about it. It's just something that always confuses me, applauding a bloke whose actions could have cost us. Like praising the dog for shitting on your carpet, or fist bumping the driver who's just run in the back of you. Think about it, Rob, if you take away the sympathetic round of applause for a red carded player, then Ben Petty would have retired without a single moment of positive attention in his entire career. Is that really what you want?
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 13:25:16 GMT
I just don't see the need to coddle them in that scenario. He's not going to be crying into his pillow about it. It's just something that always confuses me, applauding a bloke whose actions could have cost us. Like praising the dog for shitting on your carpet, or fist bumping the driver who's just run in the back of you. Think about it, Rob, if you take away the sympathetic round of applause for a red carded player, then Ben Petty would have retired without a single moment of positive attention in his entire career. Is that really what you want? No sir. Sorry sir.
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Post by Kjones9 on Oct 31, 2014 13:58:07 GMT
Also we wouldn't have clapped Tosh McKinley at all.
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Post by AlbertTatlock on Oct 31, 2014 14:08:12 GMT
Cost us the match, 2 definite yellow cards and the second gave Mason no alternative but to show him red. Gouranga. Cutting him no slack then? No he fucked up and it cost us, if it were Whelan, Wilson or Walters how many on here would be cutting them some slack? Gouranga.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 14:16:00 GMT
whilst Albert may usually be a miserable wanker in this case i'm in full agreement. whether Crouch has been good for us the last few years and whether we should be grateful for all he's done is 100% completely and utterly irrelevant to this thread! he screwed up..that second tackle would (i reckon) have got him a straight red if he hadn't already had a yellow, the ref just showed some common sense in the way he sent him off but he was bound to be going off one way or the other anyway; no need at all to be making challenges like that especially when WE had the momentum. he gave away a free kick that he would usually be there to clear away and left us royally in the shit. what he's done in the past does NOT give him some kind of green card to just do whatever he wants and let the team down whenever he feels like it from now on with complete impunity. he cost us, no doubt about that and as Albert rightly says, if that was SJW or Wilson that had done that there'd have been knives out all over this board!
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Post by dozintheseventees on Oct 31, 2014 14:19:11 GMT
It's a football match for God's sake and these things happen in the heat of the contest. Of course it was a stupid challenge at that stage but which of us hasn't acted in haste before engaging the brain first? Plenty of our players have done it in the past and I'm sure we'll see plenty more do it in the future. Crouchy has had a good season so far and always gives it his all, as he did on Wednesday. Shock, horror, his own fans applaud him as he leaves....get over it.
Your post beat mine Mick........I don't think anyone is saying he was anything but in the wrong and, you're right, past efforts don't excuse a poor decision by him. I'm just struggling to see why any of that equates to his own fans being 'prohibited' from applauding their player as he leaves the pitch. He got it wrong but there's more than a little over-reaction going on here IMO.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 14:20:20 GMT
Cutting him no slack then? No he fucked up and it cost us, if it were Whelan, Wilson or Walters how many on here would be cutting them some slack? Gouranga. Tad harsh. It's not like we were down to 10 men for a large portion of the match. First yellow was soft too. It's not as if he is a repeat offender. I'm not sure calling him an utter bellend is entirely fair. Blancmange
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 14:48:11 GMT
No he fucked up and it cost us, if it were Whelan, Wilson or Walters how many on here would be cutting them some slack? Gouranga. Tad harsh. It's not like we were down to 10 men for a large portion of the match. First yellow was soft too. It's not as if he is a repeat offender. I'm not sure calling him an utter bellend is entirely fair. Blancmange he isn't calling him a bellend in general though is he? just a bellend for getting the red card and he's right... if he hadn't gone for that challenge then they wouldn't have the free kick they scored from, if he hadn't gone in the way he did and stayed on the pitch then he may well have been in there to clear the danger. he gave away the free kick and left us 1 man down when it came to defending that free kick. there was no need for him to even challenge in the first place, it was idiotic full stop. doesn't mean he's a bad player and doesn't mean he hasn't done well for us since he came a few years back but there's no doubt that his actions certainly were bellend-esque and DID cost us; he gave them the chance to score and also left us a man down to defend that chance end of really
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 15:00:43 GMT
It's a football match for God's sake and these things happen in the heat of the contest. Of course it was a stupid challenge at that stage but which of us hasn't acted in haste before engaging the brain first? Plenty of our players have done it in the past and I'm sure we'll see plenty more do it in the future. Crouchy has had a good season so far and always gives it his all, as he did on Wednesday. Shock, horror, his own fans applaud him as he leaves....get over it. Your post beat mine Mick........I don't think anyone is saying he was anything but in the wrong and, you're right, past efforts don't excuse a poor decision by him. I'm just struggling to see why any of that equates to his own fans being 'prohibited' from applauding their player as he leaves the pitch. He got it wrong but there's more than a little over-reaction going on here IMO. I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 15:03:18 GMT
It's a football match for God's sake and these things happen in the heat of the contest. Of course it was a stupid challenge at that stage but which of us hasn't acted in haste before engaging the brain first? Plenty of our players have done it in the past and I'm sure we'll see plenty more do it in the future. Crouchy has had a good season so far and always gives it his all, as he did on Wednesday. Shock, horror, his own fans applaud him as he leaves....get over it. Your post beat mine Mick........I don't think anyone is saying he was anything but in the wrong and, you're right, past efforts don't excuse a poor decision by him. I'm just struggling to see why any of that equates to his own fans being 'prohibited' from applauding their player as he leaves the pitch. He got it wrong but there's more than a little over-reaction going on here IMO. I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue. If the sending off was harsh or blatantly a poor decision, to show support perhaps?
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 15:04:40 GMT
I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue. If the sending off was harsh or blatantly a poor decision, to show support perhaps? Yeah, fair enough where it's a poor decision. I'm not sure why you need to 'show support' when a bloke's just potentially cost you the game otherwise.
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Post by dozintheseventees on Oct 31, 2014 15:07:35 GMT
It's a football match for God's sake and these things happen in the heat of the contest. Of course it was a stupid challenge at that stage but which of us hasn't acted in haste before engaging the brain first? Plenty of our players have done it in the past and I'm sure we'll see plenty more do it in the future. Crouchy has had a good season so far and always gives it his all, as he did on Wednesday. Shock, horror, his own fans applaud him as he leaves....get over it. Your post beat mine Mick........I don't think anyone is saying he was anything but in the wrong and, you're right, past efforts don't excuse a poor decision by him. I'm just struggling to see why any of that equates to his own fans being 'prohibited' from applauding their player as he leaves the pitch. He got it wrong but there's more than a little over-reaction going on here IMO. I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue. I just don't think the two are related rob. I don't think he got applauded off BECAUSE he had been sent off. I just think some fans showed their support for a player that has been playing well, always puts it all in and is usually a credit to our club, despite the fact that (on this occasion) he made a poor choice on the field. I really don't see any problem there.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 15:08:13 GMT
If the sending off was harsh or blatantly a poor decision, to show support perhaps? Yeah, fair enough where it's a poor decision. I'm not sure why you need to 'show support' when a bloke's just potentially cost you the game otherwise. Agreed. I tend to find a round of f***s will usually suffice.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 15:47:50 GMT
I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue. I just don't think the two are related rob. I don't think he got applauded off BECAUSE he had been sent off. I just think some fans showed their support for a player that has been playing well, always puts it all in and is usually a credit to our club, despite the fact that (on this occasion) he made a poor choice on the field. I really don't see any problem there. he cost us a possible place in the quarters of a major cup against a side we'd be massive favourites to beat and then go through to the semis. applauding him for what he's done on the pitch in the past and because he's usually a credit to the club is pointless as we applauded him back then at the time when he did play well and he was a credit to us didn't we? why would we need to do it weeks later at a different game?? the applause for players at any game is pretty much (well, for me anyway) for what they've done today in this game, not what they've done 3 weeks ago or over a period of 3 or 4 years. do people still give SJW a standing ovation nowadays because of the superb goal he scored against Chelsea a few years back or for his brace in the semi at wembley?
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Post by dozintheseventees on Oct 31, 2014 15:57:24 GMT
I just don't think the two are related rob. I don't think he got applauded off BECAUSE he had been sent off. I just think some fans showed their support for a player that has been playing well, always puts it all in and is usually a credit to our club, despite the fact that (on this occasion) he made a poor choice on the field. I really don't see any problem there. he cost us a possible place in the quarters of a major cup against a side we'd be massive favourites to beat and then go through to the semis. applauding him for what he's done on the pitch in the past and because he's usually a credit to the club is pointless as we applauded him back then at the time when he did play well and he was a credit to us didn't we? why would we need to do it weeks later at a different game?? the applause for players at any game is pretty much (well, for me anyway) for what they've done today in this game, not what they've done 3 weeks ago or over a period of 3 or 4 years. do people still give SJW a standing ovation nowadays because of the superb goal he scored against Chelsea a few years back or for his brace in the semi at wembley? No Mick, we should applaud SJW for the excellent contribution he's currently making. Seriously though, what do you think fans SHOULD do? Boo him as he leaves the pitch? Let him leave in silence and maybe glare at him for being an idiot? Or what Mick? They simply applauded one of our players who IS a credit to our club and that's fine by me. You can argue that he made a stupid decision that cost us the game and I'd (possibly) agree with you but he isn't the first and won't be the last to do that. Those applauding him were not excusing his actions but simply supporting one of our players that has, IMO, deserved that kind of support. Obviously you disagree....that's fine mate.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 16:39:20 GMT
Yeah, fair enough where it's a poor decision. I'm not sure why you need to 'show support' when a bloke's just potentially cost you the game otherwise. Agreed. I tend to find a round of f***s will usually suffice. I think that's a decent resolution for most things mate.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 16:41:03 GMT
he cost us a possible place in the quarters of a major cup against a side we'd be massive favourites to beat and then go through to the semis. applauding him for what he's done on the pitch in the past and because he's usually a credit to the club is pointless as we applauded him back then at the time when he did play well and he was a credit to us didn't we? why would we need to do it weeks later at a different game?? the applause for players at any game is pretty much (well, for me anyway) for what they've done today in this game, not what they've done 3 weeks ago or over a period of 3 or 4 years. do people still give SJW a standing ovation nowadays because of the superb goal he scored against Chelsea a few years back or for his brace in the semi at wembley? No Mick, we should applaud SJW for the excellent contribution he's currently making. Seriously though, what do you think fans SHOULD do? Boo him as he leaves the pitch? Let him leave in silence and maybe glare at him for being an idiot? Or what Mick? They simply applauded one of our players who IS a credit to our club and that's fine by me. You can argue that he made a stupid decision that cost us the game and I'd (possibly) agree with you but he isn't the first and won't be the last to do that. Those applauding him were not excusing his actions but simply supporting one of our players that has, IMO, deserved that kind of support. Obviously you disagree....that's fine mate. Yeah, let him leave in silence and glare at him for being an idiot is pretty much exactly what I was doing Doz.
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Post by dozintheseventees on Oct 31, 2014 16:44:32 GMT
No Mick, we should applaud SJW for the excellent contribution he's currently making. Seriously though, what do you think fans SHOULD do? Boo him as he leaves the pitch? Let him leave in silence and maybe glare at him for being an idiot? Or what Mick? They simply applauded one of our players who IS a credit to our club and that's fine by me. You can argue that he made a stupid decision that cost us the game and I'd (possibly) agree with you but he isn't the first and won't be the last to do that. Those applauding him were not excusing his actions but simply supporting one of our players that has, IMO, deserved that kind of support. Obviously you disagree....that's fine mate. Yeah, let him leave in silence and glare at him for being an idiot is pretty much exactly what I was doing Doz. Fair enough rob. I was stuck at work and simply threw my diary across the room.
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Post by huddy on Oct 31, 2014 16:54:06 GMT
No Mick, we should applaud SJW for the excellent contribution he's currently making. Seriously though, what do you think fans SHOULD do? Boo him as he leaves the pitch? Let him leave in silence and maybe glare at him for being an idiot? Or what Mick? They simply applauded one of our players who IS a credit to our club and that's fine by me. You can argue that he made a stupid decision that cost us the game and I'd (possibly) agree with you but he isn't the first and won't be the last to do that. Those applauding him were not excusing his actions but simply supporting one of our players that has, IMO, deserved that kind of support. Obviously you disagree....that's fine mate. Yeah, let him leave in silence and glare at him for being an idiot is pretty much exactly what I was doing Doz. Well that showed him!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 17:01:29 GMT
Yeah, let him leave in silence and glare at him for being an idiot is pretty much exactly what I was doing Doz. Fair enough rob. I was stuck at work and simply threw my diary across the room. i always thought a disappointed glare would work better maybe with a collective sigh thrown in (it always did for me at school...far worse for someone to be "disappointed" in you than just getting a bollocking) i'd also be interested to see what it would sound like to have 23,000 people tutting at the same time (although let's face it, there'd always be at least one section who wouldn't keep in time with the tutting!)
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Post by dozintheseventees on Oct 31, 2014 17:04:40 GMT
Fair enough rob. I was stuck at work and simply threw my diary across the room. i always thought a disappointed glare would work better maybe with a collective sigh thrown in (it always did for me at school...far worse for someone to be "disappointed" in you than just getting a bollocking) i'd also be interested to see what it would sound like to have 23,000 people tutting at the same time (although let's face it, there'd always be at least one section who wouldn't keep in time with the tutting!) I believe that Block 19 are premature tutters.
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Post by chiefdelilah on Oct 31, 2014 17:27:50 GMT
i always thought a disappointed glare would work better maybe with a collective sigh thrown in (it always did for me at school...far worse for someone to be "disappointed" in you than just getting a bollocking) i'd also be interested to see what it would sound like to have 23,000 people tutting at the same time (although let's face it, there'd always be at least one section who wouldn't keep in time with the tutting!) I believe that Block 19 are premature tutters. They rush the tutting.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Oct 31, 2014 17:36:42 GMT
I'm not saying anyone should be prohibited Doz, I'm just saying I've never understood why any player (apart from possibly a Ben Petty type incident) should be applauded off after being sent off. It's like applauding an own goal or high fiving yourself when you bite your own tongue. If the sending off was harsh or blatantly a poor decision, to show support perhaps? So why clap Crouch off, it was fully deserved.
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Post by huddy on Oct 31, 2014 18:21:12 GMT
Did you boo him off then?
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Post by boskampsflaps on Oct 31, 2014 18:42:51 GMT
Did you boo him off then? I wasn't there, but no, I wouldn't have booed him off, I also wouldn't have clapped him off either, he pretty much cost us the game, why would I clap him for doing that? It isn't boo or clap, you can choose to do neither you know.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 19:09:34 GMT
If the sending off was harsh or blatantly a poor decision, to show support perhaps? So why clap Crouch off, it was fully deserved. I didn't.
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