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Post by playhowwewant on Sept 29, 2014 23:13:29 GMT
There were times when he had acres of space in front of him tonight and chances to carry the ball up the pitch. I'm a big fan of N'zonzi and I appreciate the way he keeps hold of the ball, but he didn't make the most of some counter attacking opportunities tonight. I know for a fact that he's capable of carrying the ball forward but he just doesn't seem confident enough to make the runs in fear of losing possession. Your right that's why we lost ! Oh hang on !!!!
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N'zonzi
Sept 29, 2014 23:13:57 GMT
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Post by scfcwebby on Sept 29, 2014 23:13:57 GMT
I agree that he should try and keep possession..... HOWEVER... tonight I recall twice turning and going backwards when he had good balls on going forward!
On another note, you can't shoot for shit so stop trying!!
Other than that an ok performance
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Post by ashleyscfc on Sept 29, 2014 23:22:19 GMT
Some of our fans are deluded idiots.
Sat in the q railing today, nearly got in an argument with the mainly older fans sat around me groaning and booing when nzonzi got the ball. Let alone did anything with it. He keeps posession, makes some great passes. He's been driving forward with the ball more. He wins it back.
This is a hell of a lot more than can be said for either Adam or Whelan. Neither of which are able to carry the ball, dribble, challenge or pick a decent forward pass.
How many times does Adam fall over?
How many times will glen un-necessarily run to get the ball from the centre halves only to give it back to them? Or lose the ball?
Or when teams are breaking glen just runs past players without making a challenge. Or he just stands infront of them in some palacios-esque stance, making no effort to actually win the ball back.
People banged on about wanting Adam back in the side like he was some great hope. Forgetting he lacks the engine and ability to play the role behind the striker now more than ever. But groan at Ireland, one of only two players we have who can actually play that role and initiate a counter properly. Again some of our lot have short memories, have we forgotten TP playing crouch and Adam or do we just cry for anything when things aren't going our way?
I have no idea what he brings to the team, it's like some stupid rumour that starts and makes its way onto hear or praise and grumble and the idiots just repeat it.
Actually watch the game and make your own opinion instead of the fool sat next to you.
The abuse nzonzi got tonight was disgusting, small minded, unfair and just plain stupid given the fact we would be lost without him. So he doesn't do what you want him to do, and keeps the ball. When was the last time you saw Whelan making a cutting pass like the one from Muniesa tonight.
I'm afraid some are seeing just what they want and not what actually happens in matches nowadays.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2014 23:23:47 GMT
Next week, Steven will be imperious. The following week, Steven will be sulky. The next week, Steven will accidentally run over some old lady's dog. The week after, Steven will control the game. The following week, Steven will put in a transfer request, but subtly, so we won't know if it's a real one. Tonight, Steven was annoying. That's our Steven. All is well.
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Post by werrington on Sept 29, 2014 23:26:04 GMT
Some of our fans are deluded idiots. Sat in the q railing today, nearly got in an argument with the mainly older fans sat around me groaning and booing when nzonzi got the ball. Let alone did anything with it. He keeps posession, makes some great passes. He's been driving forward with the ball more. He wins it back. This is a hell of a lot more than can be said for either Adam or Whelan. Neither of which are able to carry the ball, dribble, challenge or pick a decent forward pass. How many times does Adam fall over? How many times will glen un-necessarily run to get the ball from the centre halves only to give it back to them? Or lose the ball? Or when teams are breaking glen just runs past players without making a challenge. Or he just stands infront of them in some palacios-esque stance, making no effort to actually win the ball back. People banged on about wanting Adam back in the side like he was some great hope. Forgetting he lacks the engine and ability to play the role behind the striker now more than ever. But groan at Ireland, one of only two players we have who can actually play that role and initiate a counter properly. Again some of our lot have short memories, have we forgotten TP playing crouch and Adam or do we just cry for anything when things aren't going our way? I have no idea what he brings to the team, it's like some stupid rumour that starts and makes its way onto hear or praise and grumble and the idiots just repeat it. Actually watch the game and make your own opinion instead of the fool sat next to you. The abuse nzonzi got tonight was disgusting, small minded, unfair and just plain stupid given the fact we would be lost without him. So he doesn't do what you want him to do, and keeps the ball. When was the last time you saw Whelan making a cutting pass like the one from Muniesa tonight. I'm afraid some are seeing just what they want and not what actually happens in matches nowadays. I'll stop you there re Adam Two wins, a draw and 5 goals in the 3 games since he's been brought back onto the side We digress so back on topic
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N'zonzi
Sept 29, 2014 23:28:33 GMT
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Post by sportsman on Sept 29, 2014 23:28:33 GMT
I'm his biggest critic on here but although a couple of times he turned back, he did try keep possession tonight. .
the more confidence we get the better players like nzonzi, Ireland and bojan etc will become. Confidence is a massive thing and tonight's win will help that.
on a night like tonight and a win ill gladly cut him plenty of slack. He's played a lot worse.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 5:58:58 GMT
I thought Nzonzi was our worst player last night by some distance and poor Glenn Whelan bore the brunt of it. He was virtually in that midfield on his own, which makes his own performance even better.
Nzonzi is his own worst enemy at times. He doesn't want to put in a shift defensively and can be so off going forwards at times. His shooting is one of the worst I've seen at the top level.
He could be a top 4 player if he wanted to be, which makes it more frustrating.
I bet behind the scenes Hughes ans Cartwright are working on a replacement.
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 7:41:13 GMT
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Post by 2004 on Sept 30, 2014 7:41:13 GMT
I'm a big N'Zonzi fan but he passed it backwards too many times last night.
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Post by robwahlmann on Sept 30, 2014 7:48:52 GMT
Really frustrating at times and he always seems to look for a pass sideways or backwards instead of forward! The abilty is there though, but I really question his decision making! Terrific player who shouldn't be driven out of the club by idiots I don't know how to interpret your answer here, but I guess you like the ball going backwards or sideways when it obviously should be played forward!? Anyway you are entitled to your own opinion, but I would love to see N'Zonzi fulfill his true potential by adding the attacking part to his game as well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 7:59:05 GMT
In the second half there was a break Arni on the right and Crouch making a run behind the defender. Fonz had the ball with no opposing player within 10 feet of him then turns and slows the break down to let Newcastle back into the game. Frustrating, I see the point about the other players attacking the space for the forward pass from him also, possession is king but when you have a break on? Had a Bollocking off Bego and Whelan on 2 separate occasions first half looks uninterested didn't even celebrate at the end with the players who bothered to clap the fans.
The most frustrating thing is we know he has the talent but his attitude stinks.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 7:59:27 GMT
The treatment dished out to N'zonzi tonight by his own supporters was wrong, very harsh, embarrassing and quite frankly displayed a complete lack of knowledge about the game they were watching. He made the wrong decision ONCE in the 1st half when he should have played in Diouf but turned back and from that moment he became the boo boy. It clearly affected him and it is just sad that one of our better players is subjected to such mindless treatment. For anyone that didn't notice, 2 midfield players today did the work for 3 and I'm not knocking a clearly injured Adam in saying that. Idiots. Total, complete and utter idiots. Agreed. I sometimes wonder if some Stoke fans want to watch good football,they shit themselves everytime we keep the ball for more than 3 or 4 passes and start moaning like fuck when we keep the ball shouting "forwards" "get it up". Then low and behold when we kick the ball up front and hand the ball back to the opposition they moan like fuck again. We have a good quota of them where I sit and it winds me up to fuck.
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 8:05:06 GMT
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Post by Kjones9 on Sept 30, 2014 8:05:06 GMT
I agree that he should try and keep possession..... HOWEVER... tonight I recall twice turning and going backwards when he had good balls on going forward! On another note, you can't shoot for shit so stop trying!! Other than that an ok performance Imagine the massive overreaction if he hadn't of shot? Jeez.
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Post by PotterEd on Sept 30, 2014 8:17:10 GMT
This is a tricky one…. Around 90% of the time, for a guy in his position, it's fine to keep possession, pass sideways, backwards or whatever. But the way we're set up is all about the counter and his position puts him at the centre of that. This is the 10% where it's not OK to slow it down and pass backwards. It takes away any momentum and pace from a break and then there's no point. This happened once or twice last night and it was infuriating. To those fans who are OK with him slowing it down and who call fans with (god forbid) a different opinion 'uneducated', that's ridiculous. I don't agree with the ironic cheers for forward passes because we need him to have confidence but, at the same time, constantly passing sideways or backwards is not progressive enough, especially when we have Whelan in the team who does that as well. The thing with N’Zonzi is that if he could play a killer pass and was more progressive, he very probably wouldn’t be playing for us as that and shooting is pretty much all that’s missing from his game. So yeah… a tricky one!
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 8:18:42 GMT
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Post by Kjones9 on Sept 30, 2014 8:18:42 GMT
Isn't all this forward thinking stuff the reason many wanted Adam to start?
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Post by Jamo on the wing on Sept 30, 2014 8:23:11 GMT
By his own standards N'Zonzi had a poorish game last night but he still kept possession for us (and the stats show we were low on that last night so God knows what it would have been without him).
Hughes knows how vital he is and Steven is the main reason our possession stats (which in turn allow us to control the tempo of games and play higher up the pitch) are so much better than they used to be.
Don't get me wrong, last night he frustrated even me with his reluctance to pass forwards but in general this player is a key performer for us.
We improved once Ireland came on as he speeds the game up with one touch stuff and N'zonzi looked better for his introduction which is why I think Hughes's preferred choice is our former Man City midfielder rather than Charlie.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 8:32:01 GMT
I've just finished watching the first half again and there were two instances where he did what's been highlighted in this thread. The first time he definitely should have played Diouf in. The second time was just before half time when he was in the final third,the only real forward ball he had on was into Arnautovic's feet but he,like every other player was tightly marked,so Nzonzi did the right thing and layed it off. Hardly every single pass like some are suggesting.
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Post by borat on Sept 30, 2014 8:33:32 GMT
Dog shit AGAIN tonight . He holds up our attack and gives them chance to sort their defence out. To negative. No way on this earth was he dogshit however you are 100% correct on the last bit of your post, which is why I said I wouldn't be arsed if he was no longer in the team or sold.
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Post by foster on Sept 30, 2014 8:53:46 GMT
Could have passed forward more on a couple of occasions, but doesn't mean he was crap.
I'd say he had an average game.
Crouchy should have scored (or at least shot on target) two more times. Arnie was crap at first and got better as the game went on Adam ran out of steam after 15 minutes and didn't do much at all
To pick N'Zonzi out who actually didn't make any mistakes is harsh.
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Post by adi on Sept 30, 2014 8:56:04 GMT
He keeps the ball excellently, strong on the ball and in the tackle. He does need to venture forward a bit more with the ball at his feet like we've seen him do several times. He just needs a bit more confidence that he can take a man on. Still our best midfielder.
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Post by amershamstokie1234 on Sept 30, 2014 8:58:11 GMT
If he watches the video he will see the mistakes he makes
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Post by spitthedog on Sept 30, 2014 9:01:02 GMT
I thought Nzonzi was our worst player last night by some distance and poor Glenn Whelan bore the brunt of it. He was virtually in that midfield on his own, which makes his own performance even better. Nzonzi is his own worst enemy at times. He doesn't want to put in a shift defensively and can be so off going forwards at times. His shooting is one of the worst I've seen at the top level. He could be a top 4 player if he wanted to be, which makes it more frustrating. I bet behind the scenes Hughes ans Cartwright are working on a replacement. How can a player who never once lost possession in the match be considered our worst player? God knows what you made of Dean Whitehead? He used to pass the ball back and regularly lose possession!
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Post by steve66 on Sept 30, 2014 9:06:00 GMT
Most on here frustrated more with Nzonzi simply because we know he has the ability to do more! I am more concerned about Arnie's attitude, again another one with massive potential but he really needs to knuckle down and work a lot harder when he hasn't got the ball or when he loses possession and just gives up.
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Post by thestatusquo on Sept 30, 2014 9:11:28 GMT
I suppose it depends on what we want. If we are playing on the counter attack then the ball has to be moved quickly with purpose. However possession football does not always sit well with counter attacking football as its often less risk adverse which often slows the game down.
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Post by foster on Sept 30, 2014 9:11:38 GMT
I thought Nzonzi was our worst player last night by some distance and poor Glenn Whelan bore the brunt of it. He was virtually in that midfield on his own, which makes his own performance even better. Nzonzi is his own worst enemy at times. He doesn't want to put in a shift defensively and can be so off going forwards at times. His shooting is one of the worst I've seen at the top level. He could be a top 4 player if he wanted to be, which makes it more frustrating. I bet behind the scenes Hughes ans Cartwright are working on a replacement. Are you talking about Arnie?
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Post by Onneravineet on Sept 30, 2014 9:22:41 GMT
Some of our fans are deluded idiots. Sat in the q railing today, nearly got in an argument with the mainly older fans sat around me groaning and booing when nzonzi got the ball. Let alone did anything with it. He keeps posession, makes some great passes. He's been driving forward with the ball more. He wins it back. This is a hell of a lot more than can be said for either Adam or Whelan. Neither of which are able to carry the ball, dribble, challenge or pick a decent forward pass. How many times does Adam fall over? How many times will glen un-necessarily run to get the ball from the centre halves only to give it back to them? Or lose the ball? Or when teams are breaking glen just runs past players without making a challenge. Or he just stands infront of them in some palacios-esque stance, making no effort to actually win the ball back. People banged on about wanting Adam back in the side like he was some great hope. Forgetting he lacks the engine and ability to play the role behind the striker now more than ever. But groan at Ireland, one of only two players we have who can actually play that role and initiate a counter properly. Again some of our lot have short memories, have we forgotten TP playing crouch and Adam or do we just cry for anything when things aren't going our way? I have no idea what he brings to the team, it's like some stupid rumour that starts and makes its way onto hear or praise and grumble and the idiots just repeat it. Actually watch the game and make your own opinion instead of the fool sat next to you. The abuse nzonzi got tonight was disgusting, small minded, unfair and just plain stupid given the fact we would be lost without him. So he doesn't do what you want him to do, and keeps the ball. When was the last time you saw Whelan making a cutting pass like the one from Muniesa tonight. I'm afraid some are seeing just what they want and not what actually happens in matches nowadays. I can't click on the bastard like button on the iPad so have quoted to say you are spot on! N'Zonzi played well last night, really well and was solid. I am totally embarrassed by some of our fans, have been since we got in the Prem, it is certainly one of the negatives of being more popular!
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 9:24:00 GMT
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Post by upthefud on Sept 30, 2014 9:24:00 GMT
The treatment dished out to N'zonzi tonight by his own supporters was wrong, very harsh, embarrassing and quite frankly displayed a complete lack of knowledge about the game they were watching. He made the wrong decision ONCE in the 1st half when he should have played in Diouf but turned back and from that moment he became the boo boy. It clearly affected him and it is just sad that one of our better players is subjected to such mindless treatment. For anyone that didn't notice, 2 midfield players today did the work for 3 and I'm not knocking a clearly injured Adam in saying that. Idiots. Total, complete and utter idiots. Agreed. I sometimes wonder if some Stoke fans want to watch good football,they shit themselves everytime we keep the ball for more than 3 or 4 passes and start moaning like fuck when we keep the ball shouting "forwards" "get it up". Then low and behold when we kick the ball up front and hand the ball back to the opposition they moan like fuck again. We have a good quota of them where I sit and it winds me up to fuck. Keeping the ball in the back 5 is not good football!!! It's mind numbing! The second half was much better football because it was a lot more probing
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Post by thebet365 on Sept 30, 2014 9:27:19 GMT
The treatment dished out to N'zonzi tonight by his own supporters was wrong, very harsh, embarrassing and quite frankly displayed a complete lack of knowledge about the game they were watching. He made the wrong decision ONCE in the 1st half when he should have played in Diouf but turned back and from that moment he became the boo boy. It clearly affected him and it is just sad that one of our better players is subjected to such mindless treatment. For anyone that didn't notice, 2 midfield players today did the work for 3 and I'm not knocking a clearly injured Adam in saying that. Idiots. Total, complete and utter idiots. Agreed. I sometimes wonder if some Stoke fans want to watch good football,they shit themselves everytime we keep the ball for more than 3 or 4 passes and start moaning like fuck when we keep the ball shouting "forwards" "get it up". Then low and behold when we kick the ball up front and hand the ball back to the opposition they moan like fuck again. We have a good quota of them where I sit and it winds me up to fuck. I have no problem with us playing possession football, but it's impossible not to get frustrated when we have a good move opening up only for N'zonzi to turn back for fear of losing possession then 4 passes later it's at either Ryan or Wilson's feet and they lump it 40 yards upto crouch who wins a header but has no-one near him and we lose possession. I would much rather see N'zonzi go for the killer pass and fail than retain the ball and the above scenario to keep happening. In the final 10 minutes fine, it's whats required to close the game out but he does it most of the game.
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 9:28:29 GMT
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Post by werrington on Sept 30, 2014 9:28:29 GMT
Agreed. I sometimes wonder if some Stoke fans want to watch good football,they shit themselves everytime we keep the ball for more than 3 or 4 passes and start moaning like fuck when we keep the ball shouting "forwards" "get it up". Then low and behold when we kick the ball up front and hand the ball back to the opposition they moan like fuck again. We have a good quota of them where I sit and it winds me up to fuck. Keeping the ball in the back 5 is not good football!!! It's mind numbing! The second half was much better football because it was a lot more probing That would probably be because Newcastle had to be more open as they were one down It's all relitive
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 9:29:01 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2014 9:29:01 GMT
Agreed. I sometimes wonder if some Stoke fans want to watch good football,they shit themselves everytime we keep the ball for more than 3 or 4 passes and start moaning like fuck when we keep the ball shouting "forwards" "get it up". Then low and behold when we kick the ball up front and hand the ball back to the opposition they moan like fuck again. We have a good quota of them where I sit and it winds me up to fuck. Keeping the ball in the back 5 is not good football!!! It's mind numbing! The second half was much better football because it was a lot more probing I agree regarding the second half. And yet the Stoke faithful still moaned and groaned when every pass doesn't go forwards. Thanks for proving my point even further
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N'zonzi
Sept 30, 2014 9:30:59 GMT
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Post by fullmetaljacket on Sept 30, 2014 9:30:59 GMT
Class player.
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