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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 7:59:05 GMT
India leading 2-0. Questions over England's tactics and selection, but the big issue of the day is... will Bish end his self imposed Boycottesque boycott of England cricket threads?  Anyway - for today's game. England have nothing to lose; just go for it. Play without fear and see what happens. I predict a riot - with Hales coming good with a big, rapid ton! |
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Sept 2, 2014 8:08:48 GMT
If the selectors think Cook is good enough to open in ODIs,why not just let him open but find someone else to captain the ODIs?
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 8:20:22 GMT
If the selectors think Cook is good enough to open in ODIs,why not just let him open but find someone else to captain the ODIs? I think Cook's presence in the ODI team is a consequence of him being Captain, in that when he took over from Strauss as captain in both test and ODI he was restored into the ODI team that he'd previously been left out of. Seemed strange thinking at the time, but I guess was intended to provide continuity in leadership on the field. Anyway - he's still skipper and opening bat for the next couple of games. Let's see how he does. But he has to up his scoring rate as well as posting a decent score. These half arsed scores of 50 or so at a strike rate of under 80 aren't going to win us many games. Good test for him today. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 9:06:44 GMT
Ballance in for Bell, Moeen Ali in for Tredwell, Gurney in for Stokes.
Good to see Ballance, Tredwell can count himself extremely unlucky but i wanted Moeen in the side, didn't have to be in place of Tredwell. I don't rate Gurney personally but we'll see what occurs.
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mogg
Lads'n'Dads
Posts: 76 
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Post by mogg on Sept 2, 2014 9:13:56 GMT
Anybody got a stream?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 9:32:11 GMT
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 2, 2014 9:58:52 GMT
India leading 2-0. Questions over England's tactics and selection, but the big issue of the day is... will Bish end his self imposed Boycottesque boycott of England cricket threads? Anyway - for today's game. England have nothing to lose; just go for it. Play without fear and see what happens. I predict a riot - with Hales coming good with a big, rapid ton! Hmmm. That prediction lasted a long time  |
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Sept 2, 2014 10:03:39 GMT
England will be lucky to see out their 50 overs at this rate.
Correction,3 down now, will we last for even 35 overs?
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Sept 2, 2014 10:47:40 GMT
Lets not underestimate England,They may have come up with a plan to stop India scoring 300+runs. The plan is, if England bat 1st. get themselves all out, way short of 300 runs.  |
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 11:18:53 GMT
India leading 2-0. Questions over England's tactics and selection, but the big issue of the day is... will Bish end his self imposed Boycottesque boycott of England cricket threads? Anyway - for today's game. England have nothing to lose; just go for it. Play without fear and see what happens. I predict a riot - with Hales coming good with a big, rapid ton! Hmmm. That prediction lasted a long time Indeed - I'm forever the optimist! I did predict a 1-0 win for Stoke on Saturday, so sometimes it works. Not very often it must be said though with this England team! So now I'm looking for Root, Morgan and Butler to come up trumps. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 11:30:49 GMT
All these reverse sweep attempts have been wonderful.
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 2, 2014 11:34:43 GMT
Hmmm. That prediction lasted a long time Indeed - I'm forever the optimist! I did predict a 1-0 win for Stoke on Saturday, so sometimes it works. Not very often it must be said though with this England team! So now I'm looking for Root, Morgan and Butler to come up trumps. "So now I'm looking for Root, Morgan and Butler to come up trumps". Just like the bad old days. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 11:48:21 GMT
Moeen Ali proving that he should have been in the starting XI all along.
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Post by BigKahunaBurger on Sept 2, 2014 11:53:19 GMT
Good stuff from Ali.
Sent from my HTC One_M8 using proboards
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 12:05:30 GMT
Indeed - I'm forever the optimist! I did predict a 1-0 win for Stoke on Saturday, so sometimes it works. Not very often it must be said though with this England team! So now I'm looking for Root, Morgan and Butler to come up trumps. "So now I'm looking for Root, Morgan and Butler to come up trumps". Just like the bad old days. And the set is complete - Butler gone. Something is rotten in the state of a English cricket... and to quote an old proverb "fish rot from the head down". England whole is considerably less than the sum of its parts- which in my mind points to poor leadership. But, even though that line of thinking is where poor old Bish gets miffed (which is fair enough), it has to be said. Sadly whether it will be acted on is another question! |
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Sept 2, 2014 12:58:28 GMT
Well that went to plan, India cant score 300 now. |
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 13:54:52 GMT
Moeen Ali proving that he should have been in the starting XI all along. He did well today with the bat but an aggregate score of 124 runs in the test series at 20.6 didn't justify automatic selection. If it hadn't been for his bowling there's a good chance he'd have been left out of the side towards the end of the series. But it's a moot point 206 all out seems a pretty feeble total. We'll soon find out just how feeble. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 13:56:12 GMT
Moeen Ali proving that he should have been in the starting XI all along. He did well today with the bat but an aggregate score of 124 runs in the test series at 20.6 didn't justify automatic selection. If it hadn't been for his bowling there's a good chance he'd have been left out of the side towards the end of the series. But it's a moot point 206 all out seems a pretty feeble total. We'll soon find out just how feeble. That's Test figures, he made his name batting for Worcester in limited overs cricket and he's damn good at it. |
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 14:10:18 GMT
He did well today with the bat but an aggregate score of 124 runs in the test series at 20.6 didn't justify automatic selection. If it hadn't been for his bowling there's a good chance he'd have been left out of the side towards the end of the series. But it's a moot point 206 all out seems a pretty feeble total. We'll soon find out just how feeble. That's Test figures, he made his name batting for Worcester in limited overs cricket and he's damn good at it. Understood - but he didn't impress in the test matches. Not surprising that is considered as much as domestic ODI form - I'm assuming that is why he was left out originally. Anyway - 60 without loss after 11 overs suggests this is hoping to be another tanking. Ali or not. Maybe he'll sort it out with the ball? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 14:26:25 GMT
I think it's the overall approach to the ODI game more so than some of the personnel involved. There are players in this team who can play limited overs cricket extremely well, attacking ODI specialists but they're trying to stick to some rotten game plan given to them rather than playing how they can play.
It's when the England management, coaches, analysts and to be honest Cook who shouldn't be ODI captain all get involved and are still determined to play ODI's like it's still 1995 - taking every safe option and putting doubts into the minds of naturally attacking cricketers. That's when it all goes pear shaped.
Cooks company line of "well we have to rebuild and take time and build innings and play ourselves in and blah blah balh" It's backwards and negative yesterday thinking. Every other leading cricketing nation has moved on in the shorter form of the game and we're still stuck in a time warp.
Players like Hales who smash it around for fun in T20's and 40 over cricket then get put in the ODI side and you can see the change, as wickets fall, Cooks scrambles around, his natural game goes. They'll do the same when people like Roy and Vince get called up. Players who attack, make the opposition uncomfortable, they'll get told "if wickets go down, just try and stay in and try and build partnerships no matter what strike rate, pick up the singles etc etc, nurdle nurdle nurdle" and everything that got them into the side in the first place will be beaten out of them.
Was it the last ODI or the previous one, we started batting as if it was a minefield and leaving the ball, leaving, leaving, defending. Hales was...why? It's the English game plan and it's rubbish.
I feel like Chris Waddle after England performance in the World Cup in Brazil.
We never, ever learn.
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 2, 2014 14:27:02 GMT
That's Test figures, he made his name batting for Worcester in limited overs cricket and he's damn good at it. Understood - but he didn't impress in the test matches. Not surprising that is considered as much as domestic ODI form - I'm assuming that is why he was left out originally. Anyway - 60 without loss after 11 overs suggests this is hoping to be another tanking. Ali or not. Maybe he'll sort it out with the ball? His 100 against the Sri Lankans to try and save the Headingly test was brilliant - full of guts and maturity. It showed to me that he's probably got the character to make a test batsmen. Back to the ODI - showing just how far off the level we need to be. We just seem to continue to try the same thing. When it doesn't work then they just try harder. They need to revisit the way we play ODIs - learn from the better teams. Promote some of the specialists. Stop keeping the old guard in there. |
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 2, 2014 14:42:36 GMT
I think it's the overall approach to the ODI game more so than some of the personnel involved. There are players in this team who can play limited overs cricket extremely well, attacking ODI specialists but they're trying to stick to some rotten game plan given to them rather than playing how they can play. It's when the England management, coaches, analysts and to be honest Cook who shouldn't be ODI captain all get involved and are still determined to play ODI's like it's still 1995 - taking every safe option and putting doubts into the minds of naturally attacking cricketers. That's when it all goes pear shaped. Cooks company line of "well we have to rebuild and take time and build innings and play ourselves in and blah blah balh" It's backwards and negative yesterday thinking. Every other leading cricketing nation has moved on in the shorter form of the game and we're still stuck in a time warp. Players like Hales who smash it around for fun in T20's and 40 over cricket then get put in the ODI side and you can see the change, as wickets fall, Cooks scrambles around, his natural game goes. They'll do the same when people like Roy and Vince get called up. Players who attack, make the opposition uncomfortable, they'll get told "if wickets go down, just try and stay in and try and build partnerships no matter what strike rate, pick up the singles etc etc, nurdle nurdle nurdle" and everything that got them into the side in the first place will be beaten out of them. Was it the last ODI or the previous one, we started batting as if it was a minefield and leaving the ball, leaving, leaving, defending. Hales was...why? It's the English game plan and it's rubbish. I feel like Chris Waddle after England performance in the World Cup in Brazil. We never, ever learn. Similar sentiment in my post. They just don't want to seem to go away and rethink the way we play. Just keep on plugging away and doing the same thing. |
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 14:51:49 GMT
Understood - but he didn't impress in the test matches. Not surprising that is considered as much as domestic ODI form - I'm assuming that is why he was left out originally. Anyway - 60 without loss after 11 overs suggests this is hoping to be another tanking. Ali or not. Maybe he'll sort it out with the ball? His 100 against the Sri Lankans to try and save the Headingly test was brilliant - full of guts and maturity. It showed to me that he's probably got the character to make a test batsmen. Back to the ODI - showing just how far off the level we need to be. We just seem to continue to try the same thing. When it doesn't work then they just try harder. They need to revisit the way we play ODIs - learn from the better teams. Promote some of the specialists. Stop keeping the old guard in there. His innings against Sri Lanka was awesome - but it is just one innings. But, in the same way as Stokes produced a stunning century in Perth, one great innings doesn't make you a great batter. Both Ali and Stokes have been unconvincing since their maiden test centuries. As for making things better - I have no idea. Change must come - what that is I don't really know. Getting shot of Cook seems obvious, but he ain't the only one who is failing. That said he is the leader and under his leadership we are dismal - I'm talking ODIs here - so he needs to go. But where then? I guess that is what Moores is paid to do; find answers. |
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Post by Okie Stokie. on Sept 2, 2014 15:37:49 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 15:38:50 GMT
Wow. Just when you thought we couldn't sink any lower in the 50 over format. Embarassing beyond belief.....
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 2, 2014 15:45:40 GMT
Full respect to India - you were awesome!
As for England - I think Hancock has it right. It's the approach that needs changing as well as one or two people; specifically Cook and Moores. The latter has failed to deliver the positive cricket you promised. - so go now.
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Post by StokieAsh13 on Sept 4, 2014 0:47:19 GMT
Worst decision was to tell KP he wouldnt
play again.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Sept 4, 2014 8:16:27 GMT
Tinkering with the side may help somewhat,wholesale changes wont happen,so it is down to the way we approach ODIs, the way we approach it now just is not working,if the pitch on Friday takes spin then we need 2 front line spinners at least,if Cook has to play, then why not drop him down to say 4, M Ali took them on in the last game, why not try him opening the batting? if it comes off, we could have runs on the board which will take the pressure off the middle order, if it doesn't come off, at least we have tried something different.
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