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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 14:35:08 GMT
I'm failing to understand the point of airing this crime watch episode in the UK, and why now ? surely it should have been aired in Portugal ? why was it aired at all ? how many people don't already know about this case ? it's perpetually been in the news for 6 years straight! everyone knows the story of how the alleged abduction happened and other efits were issues 5 years ago. Also, can you remember someone you saw on holiday from 6 years ago ? they say they've had one thousand calls as a result of the crime watch episode, but how many of them are old biddies ringing in saying "he looks like frank who lives down my street" ?. I'd love to know what happened to her, and see her reunited with her family, but the whole thing is one big media circus now, politicians and the police probably just see it as good PR and the McCanns are being willingly used to these ends. i think the mccanns pr machine are using the media circus and police to deflect attention from the truth and their neglect
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 14:40:43 GMT
the tapas 7 news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7331034.stm•1730: Kate and Gerry McCann pick up their three children from afternoon tea at the Ocean Club •1800: Gerry begins a game of tennis with other guests •1840: David Payne checks on Kate and the children, at Gerry's request and sees Madeleine •1900: Gerry finishes playing tennis •2035: Kate and Gerry McCann arrive at the Ocean Club's tapas restaurant •2105: Gerry checks on his children, and sees Madeleine alive and well •2115: Having left the table to check on her own children, Jane Tanner sees a man carrying a child, close to the McCanns' apartment •2130: Matthew Oldfield checks on the McCanns' apartment. Hearing no noise from the children's bedroom, he assumes all is well and leaves without seeing Madeleine •2200: Kate McCann checks on her children. Madeleine is gone. did these fuckers spend any time with their kids on holiday?
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Post by cartman123 on Oct 15, 2013 14:45:04 GMT
I've just been reading this: www.cwporter.com/mccann.htmThere's some pretty compelling evidence there. If they were guilty I find it hard to fathom why they have not been brought to justice. But I suppose without a body you can't get a conviction.
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 14:48:35 GMT
I've just been reading this: www.cwporter.com/mccann.htmThere's some pretty compelling evidence there. If they were guilty I find it hard to fathom why they have not been brought to justice. But I suppose without a body you can't get a conviction. all the evidence is circumstantial hard to secure a conviction, similarily there is no evidence to back up abductions theories either..quite a few people have said to me that the british police keep it in the limelight hoping someone will crack most crimes aginst children, parents, friends of parents and local residents are normally involved somewhere
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Post by Yorkshirepotter on Oct 15, 2013 14:54:28 GMT
Grown men whipping themselves up in to a frenzy of innuendo, supposition and frankly just plain make belief on this thread is nothing short of laughable. This. The whole thing's a tragedy no-matter what the truth, but it's almost as if some posters are personally involved. Strange. You could say the same about any news story that is discussed on here,is this not the point of boards like this? I think the reason a lot of people get wound up about it is the constant coverage of this case over the hundreds of children who go missing each year, yet the parents behaviour from the beginning has been very strange. Refusing to answer questions in the police investigation and the changing of their story repeatedly are two things that stand out as utterly bizarre. Add to this the media, especially the BBC, refusing to ask difficult questions about many aspects of the case that are not supposition or rumour but documented facts from the investigation and their refusal to mention that this is anything but an abduction when there is very little evidence pointing to that.
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 15, 2013 15:52:07 GMT
This. The whole thing's a tragedy no-matter what the truth, but it's almost as if some posters are personally involved. Strange. You could say the same about any news story that is discussed on here,is this not the point of boards like this? I think the reason a lot of people get wound up about it is the constant coverage of this case over the hundreds of children who go missing each year, yet the parents behaviour from the beginning has been very strange. Refusing to answer questions in the police investigation and the changing of their story repeatedly are two things that stand out as utterly bizarre. Add to this the media, especially the BBC, refusing to ask difficult questions about many aspects of the case that are not supposition or rumour but documented facts from the investigation and their refusal to mention that this is anything but an abduction when there is very little evidence pointing to that. I've read the links above and I understand the points you raise - I'm just surprised at the level of abuse and lynch-mob mentality that accompany some of the posts. Innocent until proven guilty and all that!
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Post by dexter97 on Oct 15, 2013 16:26:58 GMT
Prior to the last couple of days, I wasn't particularly well-informed about this case beyond the usual TV and radio news. I'd always regarded some of the McCanns' behaviour as a little odd, but I'd put that down to them feeling guilty about their role, while publicly denying any responsibility.
Having now devoted a bit of time to studying it in more detail, there certainly seem to be a range of inconsistencies and incongruous behaviour that, while circumstantial, are too numerous to ignore. The evidence that really concerns me though is that of the cadaver dogs. Yes, it's impossible to corroborate, but the odds of them being wrong (especially given their track record) seem very long.
What I find really interesting now is that the focus has moved to the second "abduction" sighting by the Smiths at 22.00, and one of those artist's impressions is a dead-ringer for Gerry. Or am I the only one that thinks it looks like him?
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Post by serpico on Oct 15, 2013 18:01:55 GMT
If there was blood/cadaver odor in the hire car this means they would have to have moved the body in the full glare of the media, would this be possible ? post alleged abduction they were the most watched people on the planet, weren't they ? bit risky to go back to where the body was hidden and move it ? seems a bit far fetched to me, couldn't there have been another explanation for the dog finding an odor ?.
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Post by cartman123 on Oct 15, 2013 18:35:28 GMT
If there was blood/cadaver odor in the hire car this means they would have to have moved the body in the full glare of the media, would this be possible ? post alleged abduction they were the most watched people on the planet, weren't they ? bit risky to go back to where the body was hidden and move it ? seems a bit far fetched to me, couldn't there have been another explanation for the dog finding an odor ?. No, that's not what is being said. Cadaver smell can be transferred onto clothes. So the smell transferred onto the clothes of the parents, which in turn transferred the smell to the inside of the car.
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 15, 2013 18:58:15 GMT
If there was blood/cadaver odor in the hire car this means they would have to have moved the body in the full glare of the media, would this be possible ? post alleged abduction they were the most watched people on the planet, weren't they ? bit risky to go back to where the body was hidden and move it ? seems a bit far fetched to me, couldn't there have been another explanation for the dog finding an odor ?. No, that's not what is being said. Cadaver smell can be transferred onto clothes. So the smell transferred onto the clothes of the parents, which in turn transferred the smell to the inside of the car. If the smell can be transferred so easily and the dogs are so very sensitive to it.... doesn't that support the claims that the odour could have been picked up at work being as they are both Doctors? And then transferred into the apartment, wardrobe, car etc? I'm assuming that they don't undergo a nuclear-type decontamination every time they leave work, and Mrs has stated that she was in contact with 6 bodies prior to the holiday - if that was inconsistent with her usual job-description surely somebody would have pointed this out?
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 19:02:16 GMT
What claims?
She refused to answer questions
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Post by starkiller on Oct 15, 2013 19:39:09 GMT
The first Crimewatch to completely ignore a police investigation.
1000 calls?
Either there were an awful lot of folk about that night or people were ringing in to confirm the photofit as Gerry McCann.
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Post by Yorkshirepotter on Oct 15, 2013 19:57:05 GMT
If there was blood/cadaver odor in the hire car this means they would have to have moved the body in the full glare of the media, would this be possible ? post alleged abduction they were the most watched people on the planet, weren't they ? bit risky to go back to where the body was hidden and move it ? seems a bit far fetched to me, couldn't there have been another explanation for the dog finding an odor ?. It is virtually impossible to believe they moved the body but very possible to move clothing, towels or anything else they used to clean up any blood or move a body in.
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 15, 2013 20:07:07 GMT
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 15, 2013 20:23:49 GMT
The first Crimewatch to completely ignore a police investigation. 1000 calls? Either there were an awful lot of folk about that night or people were ringing in to confirm the photofit as Gerry McCann. I was under the impression that the police investigation had been discredited - seeing as we are spunking £5M on this new enquiry
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 20:29:53 GMT
Whilst I believe the situation is fishy
You want to google maddie McCann and the illuminati some great works out there
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 15, 2013 20:41:29 GMT
Whilst I believe the situation is fishy You want to google maddie McCann and the illuminati some great works out there Starkiller's rubbing off on you mate ..... but then again - some of his links do make interesting reading
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 20:53:14 GMT
That's a great read, no lies and innuendo but a rational version of facts
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 20:54:13 GMT
Whilst I believe the situation is fishy You want to google maddie McCann and the illuminati some great works out there Starkiller's rubbing off on you mate ..... but then again - some of his links do make interesting reading You never know the plot thickens. There has been a lot of British and American top level interference
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Post by cartman123 on Oct 15, 2013 21:09:06 GMT
Salop, are you now claiming the devil is responsible for the disappearance of Madeline McCann?
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Post by salopstick on Oct 15, 2013 21:12:50 GMT
Salop, are you now claiming the devil is responsible for the disappearance of Madeline McCann? Only if Gerry McCann is the devil
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Post by marrer on Oct 16, 2013 2:56:03 GMT
Rubbish Salop. People react to grief in different ways. You can't judge someone solely on the body language. It doesn't work like that. If they killed her, where's the kid now? They would have found a body, or at least remains of some kind. Have to agree with Cartman; over here in Oz we had the Lindy Chamberlain case and the missing baby that they claimed was taken by dingoes. The parents used to answer some questions in bizarre ways that caused much of Australia to proclaim that the Chamberlains did it. So off to jail they went. Then they were pardoned, then they were re-trialled on and on it went. Their marriage split up and they were continually seen as guilty. About two years ago, physical evidence of clothing with bite marks was uncovered near to Ayers Rock where she disappeared and finally a tearful judge proclaimed them innocent and said a huge miscarriage of justice had been done. There's no reason to think that it isn't the same in the McCann case is there? (except that there are no dingoes in Spain www.theaustralian.com.au/arts/review/how-did-we-get-it-so-wrong-in-the-azaria-chamberlain-murder-case/story-fn9n8gph-1226429825576#
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Post by kidcrewbob on Oct 16, 2013 6:11:34 GMT
Fascinating and more bizarre by the day.......theyve dug themselves a hole (and very publically so) from which only a full and frank confession OR finding the girl (alive or not) will extricate them from it........
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Post by britsabroad on Oct 16, 2013 6:30:55 GMT
"Crimewatch editor Joe Mather said several callers gave the same man's name after e-fit pictures were shown"
That's the father fucked then...
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Post by lawrieleslie on Oct 16, 2013 6:34:17 GMT
No, that's not what is being said. Cadaver smell can be transferred onto clothes. So the smell transferred onto the clothes of the parents, which in turn transferred the smell to the inside of the car. If the smell can be transferred so easily and the dogs are so very sensitive to it.... doesn't that support the claims that the odour could have been picked up at work being as they are both Doctors? And then transferred into the apartment, wardrobe, car etc? I'm assuming that they don't undergo a nuclear-type decontamination every time they leave work, and Mrs has stated that she was in contact with 6 bodies prior to the holiday - if that was inconsistent with her usual job-description surely somebody would have pointed this out? But wasn't Maddies DNA in the sampling both in the car and the appartment once both dogs had confirmed the presence of cadaver and blood particles? If you research Keela and Eddie it becomes obvious that these two extraordinary dogs are trained only to sniff out human cadaver and human blood and to ignore other purifying animal flesh and animal blood. Now Gerry McCann explained the presence of cadaver and blood in the hire car as coming from meat that had fallen out of a shopping bag. Why has all this evidence collected by these dogs just been brushed under the carpet? Or has it, as previous poster said, the police may be setting the McCanns up. This would partly explain the piss taking e-fit photos that incriminate Gerry McCann and the detective in charge of the British investigation.
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Post by dexter97 on Oct 16, 2013 7:35:43 GMT
Rubbish Salop. People react to grief in different ways. You can't judge someone solely on the body language. It doesn't work like that. If they killed her, where's the kid now? They would have found a body, or at least remains of some kind. Have to agree with Cartman; over here in Oz we had the Lindy Chamberlain case and the missing baby that they claimed was taken by dingoes. The parents used to answer some questions in bizarre ways that caused much of Australia to proclaim that the Chamberlains did it. So off to jail they went. Then they were pardoned, then they were re-trialled on and on it went. Their marriage split up and they were continually seen as guilty. About two years ago, physical evidence of clothing with bite marks was uncovered near to Ayers Rock where she disappeared and finally a tearful judge proclaimed them innocent and said a huge miscarriage of justice had been done. There's no reason to think that it isn't the same in the McCann case is there? (except that there are no dingoes in Spain www.theaustralian.com.au/arts/review/how-did-we-get-it-so-wrong-in-the-azaria-chamberlain-murder-case/story-fn9n8gph-1226429825576#The Azaria Chamberlain case is one of the reasons I've never jumped on the particular bandwagon that adduces the McCanns' odd behaviour as evidence of their guilt. There are some interesting parallels between the two cases. One of the main differences though is that Lindy was pretty much tried and convicted by the press, and the majority of Aussie public opinion went along for the ride, whereas the McCanns have retained a lot of support from the media, the public and even the British Establishment. There was questionable forensic evidence involving "blood" in the boot of their car used in that case too, although the technology available back then was Bronze Age by comparison. I'm undecided, but the cadaver dog evidence is compelling.
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Post by Pedropotter on Oct 16, 2013 7:39:00 GMT
How could the scottish family have seen Gerry at 10pm when he was seen by everyone at the apartments raising the alarm at the same time? Or are folk saying that all their friends were all in on it?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2013 7:43:42 GMT
How could the scottish family have seen Gerry at 10pm when he was seen by everyone at the apartments raising the alarm at the same time? Or are folk saying that all their friends were all in on it? I don't know about the guy seen at 10pm but Im in the opinion there is more to your last question than meets the eye in my opinion
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Post by countofmontecristo on Oct 16, 2013 8:50:41 GMT
If the smell can be transferred so easily and the dogs are so very sensitive to it.... doesn't that support the claims that the odour could have been picked up at work being as they are both Doctors? And then transferred into the apartment, wardrobe, car etc? I'm assuming that they don't undergo a nuclear-type decontamination every time they leave work, and Mrs has stated that she was in contact with 6 bodies prior to the holiday - if that was inconsistent with her usual job-description surely somebody would have pointed this out? But wasn't Maddies DNA in the sampling both in the car and the appartment once both dogs had confirmed the presence of cadaver and blood particles? If you research Keela and Eddie it becomes obvious that these two extraordinary dogs are trained only to sniff out human cadaver and human blood and to ignore other purifying animal flesh and animal blood. Now Gerry McCann explained the presence of cadaver and blood in the hire car as coming from meat that had fallen out of a shopping bag. Why has all this evidence collected by these dogs just been brushed under the carpet? Or has it, as previous poster said, the police may be setting the McCanns up. This would partly explain the piss taking e-fit photos that incriminate Gerry McCann and the detective in charge of the British investigation. But wasn't Maddies DNA in the sampling both in the car and the appartment once both dogs had confirmed the presence of cadaver and blood particles? Can't DNA be transferred from one surface to another in the same way as odours? If so, wouldn't it be MORE strange if Maddie's DNA was NOT found all over the place due to cross-contamination ? If you research Keela and Eddie it becomes obvious that these two extraordinary dogs are trained only to sniff out human cadaver and human blood and to ignore other purifying animal flesh and animal blood.
The dogs extra-ordinary ability allows them to detect infinitesimal amounts of odour from items that have been in contact with items that have been in contact with items (ad infinitum?) that have been in contact with cadavers. Mrs had been in contact with 6 cadavers prior to the holiday (see posts above). Now Gerry McCann explained the presence of cadaver and blood in the hire car as coming from meat that had fallen out of a shopping bag. If you were asked "how did blood get in your car boot?" and you hadn't killed your daughter, but you had spilled meat on a shopping trip, what would you answer? The cadaverine odour can be explained by cross-contamination as above. Same with the blood as it appears that Maddie cut her leg on holiday. Why has all this evidence collected by these dogs just been brushed under the carpet I think the fact that the dogs are so incredibly sensitive works against them. They seem able to detect evidence so far removed from the scene that it becomes inconclusive. And their use around people who deal with the dead and bleeding for a living seems questionable IMO. Or has it, as previous poster said, the police may be setting the McCanns up If so I hope it works at £5Million that Cameron's pledged! The photo-fits do seem like a piss-take and just add another layer of confusion to the whole thing. I'm no great fan of the McCann's and if they're innocent then they've been the victims of an unfortunate series of circumstances that points fingers at them. But for now (and in light of the Chamberlain story above) I think they should get the benefit of the doubt.
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Post by Yorkshirepotter on Oct 16, 2013 9:16:06 GMT
But wasn't Maddies DNA in the sampling both in the car and the appartment once both dogs had confirmed the presence of cadaver and blood particles? If you research Keela and Eddie it becomes obvious that these two extraordinary dogs are trained only to sniff out human cadaver and human blood and to ignore other purifying animal flesh and animal blood. Now Gerry McCann explained the presence of cadaver and blood in the hire car as coming from meat that had fallen out of a shopping bag. Why has all this evidence collected by these dogs just been brushed under the carpet? Or has it, as previous poster said, the police may be setting the McCanns up. This would partly explain the piss taking e-fit photos that incriminate Gerry McCann and the detective in charge of the British investigation. But wasn't Maddies DNA in the sampling both in the car and the appartment once both dogs had confirmed the presence of cadaver and blood particles? Can't DNA be transferred from one surface to another in the same way as odours? If so, wouldn't it be MORE strange if Maddie's DNA was NOT found all over the place due to cross-contamination ? If you research Keela and Eddie it becomes obvious that these two extraordinary dogs are trained only to sniff out human cadaver and human blood and to ignore other purifying animal flesh and animal blood.
The dogs extra-ordinary ability allows them to detect infinitesimal amounts of odour from items that have been in contact with items that have been in contact with items (ad infinitum?) that have been in contact with cadavers. Mrs had been in contact with 6 cadavers prior to the holiday (see posts above). Now Gerry McCann explained the presence of cadaver and blood in the hire car as coming from meat that had fallen out of a shopping bag. If you were asked "how did blood get in your car boot?" and you hadn't killed your daughter, but you had spilled meat on a shopping trip, what would you answer? The cadaverine odour can be explained by cross-contamination as above. Same with the blood as it appears that Maddie cut her leg on holiday. Why has all this evidence collected by these dogs just been brushed under the carpet I think the fact that the dogs are so incredibly sensitive works against them. They seem able to detect evidence so far removed from the scene that it becomes inconclusive. And their use around people who deal with the dead and bleeding for a living seems questionable IMO. Or has it, as previous poster said, the police may be setting the McCanns up If so I hope it works at £5Million that Cameron's pledged! The photo-fits do seem like a piss-take and just add another layer of confusion to the whole thing. I'm no great fan of the McCann's and if they're innocent then they've been the victims of an unfortunate series of circumstances that points fingers at them. But for now (and in light of the Chamberlain story above) I think they should get the benefit of the doubt. The points you make are the reasons they havent been able to pin it on the parents yet. Your explainations are a stretch but would be enough to get then off in court under reasonable doubt. The dogs indicated blood that matched her DNA and cadaver smell in the car they hired 3 Weeks after she 'dissappeared'. Both were also found on her favorite toy that the mother claimed was there because she took it to work with her? Why would you regularly take your daughters favourite toy to work and why the hell would you have it on you when dealing with dead bodies? As for Maddie cutting her leg on holiday, from the files she grazed it on the plane on the way there.Highly unlikely that it would be bleeding for more than an hour or two at most, and for it to bleed enough to get into corner of a room AND seep under the tiles?
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