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Post by mickmacc on Sept 26, 2013 0:27:53 GMT
Excellent tonight.His touch and link up play was excellent.One moment on the touch line was mesmerising and I thought him and Arnautovic looked to have a good understanding.Took his goal beautifully.Pace and power or touch and finesse?I would go for Crouch against Norwich.
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chris9
Academy Starlet
[F4:dicko9]
Posts: 117
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Post by chris9 on Sept 26, 2013 7:09:48 GMT
Then watch us and the Norwich def sit on the halfway line... Crouch way to easy to squeeze... Putting pressure on the rest of our team...
Crouch has to go in jan
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Post by Stokie Mcpot on Sept 26, 2013 7:19:08 GMT
Excellent against a poor side. We said the same about Jones and he hasn't really hit the mark just yet in the league. Perhaps if somebody, just somebody, can learn that crouch makes a poor target man/lone striker then he could do well for us.
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Post by werrington on Sept 26, 2013 7:22:08 GMT
Immobile and paceless was how I saw last night and the crowd getting in the players backs in the second half was down to no options up front other than Arnie
Kenwyne has to play
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Post by northstokie on Sept 26, 2013 7:24:14 GMT
Bit early for fishing....
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Post by nantwichstokie on Sept 26, 2013 8:05:38 GMT
Its not Crouchys fault but the system we play with him isolated doesn't suit his style of play at all. He needs to play as a 2 to link up with another forward. Be interesting to see Arnie and Crouch as a pair I think as they did link well tonight.
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Post by redstriper on Sept 26, 2013 8:08:11 GMT
I like crouchy but I thought he was a limiting factor in our play last night, he won a lot of the aerials but his flick-ons never got even close to any of our other players. He is so static that our chances of quick breaks outs are very limited.
He is still a handful for defenders and is a reasonable finisher but for me his future is as an impact sub when we are losing and need to try something different. That's assuming we get somebody better than KJ as a alternative.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 26, 2013 8:51:12 GMT
Excellent tonight.His touch and link up play was excellent.One moment on the touch line was mesmerising and I thought him and Arnautovic looked to have a good understanding.Took his goal beautifully.Pace and power or touch and finesse?I would go for Crouch against Norwich. You can't praise Crouch mickmacc, you'll have the Jones Nazis all over you like a Burtons suit.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 26, 2013 9:12:52 GMT
Immobile and paceless was how I saw last night and the crowd getting in the players backs in the second half was down to no options up front other than Arnie Kenwyne has to play THIS. It was a lovely goal but despite the fancy flicks and link up play, he was at his snail like best. The lack of movement ahead of the ball, not only from Crouch, in the 2nd half was frightening. The only positives from a player perspective were another good showing from Cameron and a very decent 90 minute offering from Palacios. As positive the showing of Arnie and Ireland were 1st half, their lack of fitness was very worrying.
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 26, 2013 9:16:19 GMT
Excellent tonight.His touch and link up play was excellent.One moment on the touch line was mesmerising and I thought him and Arnautovic looked to have a good understanding.Took his goal beautifully.Pace and power or touch and finesse?I would go for Crouch against Norwich. You can't praise Crouch mickmacc, you'll have the Jones Nazis all over you like a Burtons suit. You also can't praise Kenwyn, for fear of the Rimmers wanting to continue the fight that TP started (just ask Stafford). It cuts both ways. Neither are perfect for us. Neither are brilliant. Neither are that far behind the best possible striker that we could realistically hope to sign and retain.
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Sept 26, 2013 9:19:40 GMT
Dave, I can understand Ireland being a little short of match fitness but I'm surprised Arnie is. I'm assuming you'd start Arnautovic against Norwich though? I'm guessing you'd expect Adam to start and Ireland to come on as sub. Good to see Palacios offering an option. Any comment on Cameron?
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Post by mickmacc on Sept 26, 2013 9:21:52 GMT
'Peter deserved his goal because he kept the ball so well for us high up the pitch'Mark Hughes in the Sentinel.Because of his touch,vision and link up play that's what he offers instead of Kenwyne who is strong, quick(but not that quick).
You pays yer money...
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Post by luke45 on Sept 26, 2013 9:22:46 GMT
He was excellent last night, and I still think he has plenty to offer playing behind a striker, his link up play and ability to hold the ball up and bring other people into the game is still second to none. What we really need is a pacey striker playing ahead of him who can feed off Crouch's flicks though, it's no good playing Crouch on the last defender like we have in the past and did on occasions last night, he's got nowhere near enough pace to accelerate away from defenders at any level, never mind the Premier League.
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Post by skeelsy on Sept 26, 2013 9:29:39 GMT
Crouchy for England ! Scores an injury time goal against Tranmere who have conceded 12 goals in their four Division 2 home matches this season and the Crouch lovers come out of the woodwork. No pace and no physical presence and has scored a magnificent 3 goals in his last 33 PL appearances. Please god we get rid in January.
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Post by chr15 on Sept 26, 2013 9:31:00 GMT
Crouch's goal was very well taken and while he had a decent game I cannot agree that his performance was "excellent".
What confuses me is that there are contributors to this forum who belittled Jones' hat-trick against Walsall with comments of "he's found his level against League 1 opposition" and similar, yet they readily give Crouch credit for his (admittedly well taken) contribution against Tranmere - also league 1 opposition who languish in 19th in the league 1 table while Walsall sit in 7th with nearly 3 times the number of points. With tin hat firmly on, I firmly believe it is fair to say that those contributors are pursuing an agenda.
Turning to Sunday's game against Norwich, I would not be too disappointed if we started with Crouch as KJ has been goal shy in the 3 league games he has started this season and it would be a good opportunity to see whether Crouchy's relegation to the bench since his 81 minute contribution at Liverpool has in any way influenced his performance.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 26, 2013 9:47:58 GMT
The conclusion is that this blind faith that Jones is the superior option in every regard is just that. Totally blind. Both will need to play between now and January and it's up to Hughes to work out how to use them. From the quote above the manager certainly doesn't have Crouch down as the busted flush that many of the brains trust on here have.
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 26, 2013 9:56:03 GMT
Crouch's goal was very well taken and while he had a decent game I cannot agree that his performance was "excellent". What confuses me is that there are contributors to this forum who belittled Jones' hat-trick against Walsall with comments of "he's found his level against League 1 opposition" and similar, yet they readily give Crouch credit for his (admittedly well taken) contribution against Tranmere - also league 1 opposition who languish in 19th in the league 1 table while Walsall sit in 7th with nearly 3 times the number of points. With tin hat firmly on, I firmly believe it is fair to say that those contributors are pursuing an agenda. Turning to Sunday's game against Norwich, I would not be too disappointed if we started with Crouch as KJ has been goal shy in the 3 league games he has started this season and it would be a good opportunity to see whether Crouchy's relegation to the bench since his 81 minute contribution at Liverpool has in any way influenced his performance. Agree with most of what you say, but to judge Kenwyn on 3 games - 2 away (including Arsenal) and 1 home against Man City - is a bit harsh isn't it? How many goals did you expect us to bang in in these three games realistically?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Sept 26, 2013 9:57:37 GMT
Dave, I can understand Ireland being a little short of match fitness but I'm surprised Arnie is. I'm assuming you'd start Arnautovic against Norwich though? I'm guessing you'd expect Adam to start and Ireland to come on as sub. Good to see Palacios offering an option. Any comment on Cameron? Arnie definitely has to start. He carries all of our attacking threat so hopefully he will get more stamina the more games he plays. I wouldn't be surprised to see Ireland start on Sunday with Adam replacing him from the bench after an hour or so. Cameron was excellent again. He is really looking like a player, as well as a fine athlete right now. If he can sort out his crossing he would be even better. He completely wasted 3 very good positions last night. Praise for Muniesa too. He looks a fine player and he showed a bit of physicality as well. If Pieters injury keeps him out of Sunday, we have little to worry about.
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Post by PotterLog on Sept 26, 2013 9:59:35 GMT
In the first half last night Crouchy was so out of place in the system, he stuck out like a sore thumb on his own up front. Better in the second half when Arnautovic and Assaidi got closer to him and they could feed off him a little bit.
Still has something to offer if he drops deeper and has support, but not as a starter in a 433, and I'd expect him to go in January really.
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Post by foxysgloves on Sept 26, 2013 10:01:04 GMT
A smart manager, which Hughes seems to be, will use both Jones and Crouch. Hopefully they will both respond to the added competition.
Writing off a player as capable and experienced as Crouch would IMO be crazy.
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Post by Birchesheadpotter on Sept 26, 2013 10:03:27 GMT
Odd, I thought he was crap.
That mesmerising touch on the touchline you speak of was all well and good, but lets not leave out the following part where he then turned around and lifted a needless ball straight to the only Tranmere player in our half, allowing him a free run at our centre half's.
Just isn't suited to the role for me.
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Post by Stafford-Stokie on Sept 26, 2013 10:07:21 GMT
You can't praise Crouch mickmacc, you'll have the Jones Nazis all over you like a Burtons suit. You also can't praise Kenwyn, for fear of the Rimmers wanting to continue the fight that TP started (just ask Stafford). It cuts both ways. Neither are perfect for us. Neither are brilliant. Neither are that far behind the best possible striker that we could realistically hope to sign and retain. Were you born a prick or did you just grow into it? It has nothing to do with Mr Pulis that I think jones is bone idle and to be honest not very good. If you think he is good then fine but I don't.
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Post by chr15 on Sept 26, 2013 10:09:00 GMT
Crouch's goal was very well taken and while he had a decent game I cannot agree that his performance was "excellent". What confuses me is that there are contributors to this forum who belittled Jones' hat-trick against Walsall with comments of "he's found his level against League 1 opposition" and similar, yet they readily give Crouch credit for his (admittedly well taken) contribution against Tranmere - also league 1 opposition who languish in 19th in the league 1 table while Walsall sit in 7th with nearly 3 times the number of points. With tin hat firmly on, I firmly believe it is fair to say that those contributors are pursuing an agenda. Turning to Sunday's game against Norwich, I would not be too disappointed if we started with Crouch as KJ has been goal shy in the 3 league games he has started this season and it would be a good opportunity to see whether Crouchy's relegation to the bench since his 81 minute contribution at Liverpool has in any way influenced his performance. Agree with most of what you say, but to judge Kenwyn on 3 games - 2 away (including Arsenal) and 1 home against Man City - is a bit harsh isn't it? How goals did you expect us to bang in in these three games realistically? I concede that you make an excellent point, but rightly or wrongly despite the quality of the opposition and the fact that 2 of those league games were away games, many on here have (without justification, in my view) found cause to moan about Jones' effectiveness. Perhaps Sunday will prove a good opportunity to see exactly what we were missing while Crouch was on the bench?
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Post by chr15 on Sept 26, 2013 10:15:14 GMT
You also can't praise Kenwyn, for fear of the Rimmers wanting to continue the fight that TP started (just ask Stafford). It cuts both ways. Neither are perfect for us. Neither are brilliant. Neither are that far behind the best possible striker that we could realistically hope to sign and retain. Were you born a prick or did you just grow into it? It has nothing to do with Mr Pulis that I think jones is bone idle and to be honest not very good. If you think he is good then fine but I don't. Two observations, if I may: 1. It is amusing how emotional you become in your defence of Mr. Pulis. 2. If anyone should avoid calling others "prick", it should be you.
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Post by Stafford-Stokie on Sept 26, 2013 10:18:53 GMT
Were you born a prick or did you just grow into it? It has nothing to do with Mr Pulis that I think jones is bone idle and to be honest not very good. If you think he is good then fine but I don't. Two observations, if I may: 1. It is amusing how emotional you become in your defence of Mr. Pulis. 2. If anyone should avoid calling others "prick", it should be you.
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Post by leicspotter on Sept 26, 2013 10:22:57 GMT
Peter Crouch is a decent player - our current formation and personnel are not suited to his style of play. That's hardly his fault. Kenwynne Jones is a decent player - our current formation and personnel are not suited to his style of play. That's hardly his fault. (he can look a bit lazy at times - maybe that IS his fault) Our previous manager had a reputation for trying to force square pegs into round holes. Our new manager will need to find out how best to deply the resources he has or seek to recruit some new faces. As yet, neither main striking option has found the net in this season's PL. That maybe in part down to formation and style (and lack of clear chances) but also to their own abilities, confidence etc. With the exception of the game against Citeh I can't remember either Crouch or Jones having that many goal scoring opportunities...so what is the solution? Mark Hughes is being paid a substantial salary to find that solution...let's hope he earns his money! I think he will.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Sept 26, 2013 10:25:17 GMT
I haven't seen much of Norwich this season but our previous clashes have been very physical particularly in the centre half/centre forward area. I think Turner and Bassong will offer much the same battle. The preference in that case would be for an 'on it' Jones. The problem with Crouch in those types of games is that referees almost give everything against him despite him often being more sinned against. The 'bittier' the game the better for Norwich. Jones is probably the better bet.
The downside of that is that bringing Crouch on for Jones as the game opens up doesn't work, whereas the reverse does. It's a thinker alright and the options are greatly reduced without the wildcard of Jerome.
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Post by chr15 on Sept 26, 2013 10:25:30 GMT
Two observations, if I may: 1. It is amusing how emotional you become in your defence of Mr. Pulis. 2. If anyone should avoid calling others "prick", it should be you. Someone wake the old fart up!!
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Post by ukcstokie on Sept 26, 2013 10:31:43 GMT
You also can't praise Kenwyn, for fear of the Rimmers wanting to continue the fight that TP started (just ask Stafford). It cuts both ways. Neither are perfect for us. Neither are brilliant. Neither are that far behind the best possible striker that we could realistically hope to sign and retain. Were you born a prick or did you just grow into it? It has nothing to do with Mr Pulis that I think jones is bone idle and to be honest not very good. If you think he is good then fine but I don't. Sure mate. There are plenty on here who backed themselves into a corner last season with blindly following all of TP decisions (Crouch vs Kenwyn, Pennant etc.) - as there were those who blindly opposed everything that TP did. There was no thought in the matter - it was merely following what they believed to be TP's view. TP - like all managers - was right on some things and wrong on others. You seem - I apologise if I'm doing you a disservice - to blindly back TP to the hilt on everything. I can appreciate people having different opinions, but this is just following - it's not having an opinion. Regarding KJ. Your clearly blinded by your dislike of him (as your post from the first half of the Man City game clearly showed). KJ isn't perfect. Neither is Crouch. Both have their strengths and weaknesses.
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Post by foster on Sept 26, 2013 10:40:32 GMT
Crouch has proved throughout his career that he is better than Jones.
It's who is better suited to our style of play that dictates who MH selects.
As it stands I'm not convinced either shows a marked improvement over the other and will therefore make another comparison after each of them have been given more starts.
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