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Post by numpty40 on Mar 12, 2012 23:43:05 GMT
Stoke's best ever signing? £2m in the modern game?
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Post by philb on Mar 12, 2012 23:48:05 GMT
Great value at that price, but has deffo lost his way the last couple of seasons. Thought he would and probably should be in the England set up by now, but no chance at the moment.
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Post by philm87 on Mar 12, 2012 23:49:09 GMT
The only other contender would be Fuller but yeah I'd go with Ryan on that one
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Post by philm87 on Mar 12, 2012 23:50:21 GMT
Great value at that price, but has deffo lost his way the last couple of seasons. Thought he would and probably should be in the England set up by now, but no chance at the moment. I don't think he's lost his way he just hasn't got any better than he was in our second season Maybe that's a good thing because had he got any better then we would have struggled to keep hold of him
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Post by Olgrligm on Mar 12, 2012 23:52:34 GMT
The return of Sir Stanley Matthews under Waddington must surely be the club's greatest ever signing.
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Post by philb on Mar 12, 2012 23:56:44 GMT
Great value at that price, but has deffo lost his way the last couple of seasons. Thought he would and probably should be in the England set up by now, but no chance at the moment. I don't think he's lost his way he just hasn't got any better than he was in our second season Maybe that's a good thing because had he got any better then we would have struggled to keep hold of him True, because if he'd gone to Manure we all know he'd be in the England squad by now!
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bogshed
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Post by bogshed on Mar 12, 2012 23:57:43 GMT
Ryan was a great acquisition and is a true asset to us. Problem is that playing for Stoke he'll probably get overlooked for England. Harry likes him though, so you never know. Thought Ryan and Huth showed Cahill and Terry how to defend at the weekend mind.
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Post by stokiedj on Mar 13, 2012 0:01:15 GMT
IMO 3 million for begovic was better than that for shawcross. Simply because i believe begovic has massive potential to be world class, whereas i dont think shawcross could be.
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Post by philm87 on Mar 13, 2012 0:05:27 GMT
IMO 3 million for begovic was better than that for shawcross. Simply because i believe begovic has massive potential to be world class, whereas i dont think shawcross could be. Time will tell. I don't think Ryan will ever be world class but I'm not so sure Bego will be either.
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bogshed
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Post by bogshed on Mar 13, 2012 0:10:58 GMT
IMO 3 million for begovic was better than that for shawcross. Simply because i believe begovic has massive potential to be world class, whereas i dont think shawcross could be. I hope you're right. He makes me very nervous in fairly routine situations, spills quite a few and likes punching the ball too much. Then he goes and makes a save which defies the laws of physics! Drives me nuts!
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Post by stokiedj on Mar 13, 2012 0:16:41 GMT
IMO 3 million for begovic was better than that for shawcross. Simply because i believe begovic has massive potential to be world class, whereas i dont think shawcross could be. I hope you're right. He makes me very nervous in fairly routine situations, spills quite a few and likes punching the ball too much. Then he goes and makes a save which defies the laws of physics! Drives me nuts! Its the things what need touching up mate, his kicking is another. Once he has worked on these with a decent pre season he will be amazing next season you watch. Sorensen is 10 years older than him and still cant pull off some of the saves asmir does. The potential of this guy is insane ans pulis recognises this and doesnt want to loose him when a big club comes sniffing in summer.
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Post by philm87 on Mar 13, 2012 0:18:04 GMT
I hope you're right. He makes me very nervous in fairly routine situations, spills quite a few and likes punching the ball too much. Then he goes and makes a save which defies the laws of physics! Drives me nuts! Its the things what need touching up mate, his kicking is another. Once he has worked on these with a decent pre season he will be amazing next season you watch. Sorensen is 10 years older than him and still cant pull off some of the saves asmir does. The potential of this guy is insane ans pulis recognises this and doesnt want to loose him when a big club comes sniffing in summer. Good thing we've got him on a long contract
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bogshed
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Post by bogshed on Mar 13, 2012 0:21:35 GMT
Bego and Tommy along with Ryan and Huth are Pulis' best achievements.
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lewis2k
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Post by lewis2k on Mar 13, 2012 0:30:21 GMT
Before the start of this season I would of said super Jon, shawcross had to get himself back into the team in the first season we came up to the promise land because he didn't adapt well
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Post by kidsintheriot on Mar 13, 2012 1:07:04 GMT
He had an absolute nightmare in our 1st game at Bolton and looked out of his depth. Signing big Abdy gave Shawcross that experience alongside him and has been class ever since.
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Post by mark71 on Mar 13, 2012 1:42:47 GMT
I can't believe some of the comments on this thread. "lost his way" "hasn't got any better" Shawcross is superb. He's still only 24 and has got his best years yet to come but he is still regarded as one of the best centre halves in the country. If Ryan remains at Stoke for the rest of his career he will be the best centre half we have ever had.
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Post by onionman on Mar 13, 2012 1:50:43 GMT
I can't believe some of the comments on this thread. "lost his way" "hasn't got any better" Shawcross is superb. He's still only 24 and has got his best years yet to come but he is still regarded as one of the best centre halves in the country. If Ryan remains at Stoke for the rest of his career he will be the best centre half we have ever had. Certainly in the modern era. Hard to compare with Denis Smith or Neil Franklin who I never saw. I think he's fantastic though, we're unbelievably lucky to have him, and he's probably Pulis' best signing (out of many choices). Things changed for the better the day he signed, and he's been with us every step of our development.
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Post by Bagwash on Mar 13, 2012 3:16:51 GMT
I can't believe some of the comments on this thread. "lost his way" "hasn't got any better" Shawcross is superb. He's still only 24 and has got his best years yet to come but he is still regarded as one of the best centre halves in the country. If Ryan remains at Stoke for the rest of his career he will be the best centre half we have ever had. Certainly in the modern era. Hard to compare with Denis Smith or Neil Franklin who I never saw. I think he's fantastic though, we're unbelievably lucky to have him, and he's probably Pulis' best signing (out of many choices). Things changed for the better the day he signed, and he's been with us every step of our development. Totally agree with both above statements and can't fathom out why some Stokies keep on trotting out the 'not England class' line. As I've stated numerous times before if he played for a more 'fashionable' club he would be a regular for England.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Mar 13, 2012 6:57:23 GMT
I can't believe some of the comments on this thread. "lost his way" "hasn't got any better" Shawcross is superb. He's still only 24 and has got his best years yet to come but he is still regarded as one of the best centre halves in the country. If Ryan remains at Stoke for the rest of his career he will be the best centre half we have ever had. Better than Franklin - I don't think so! I do rate Ryan but to say he could be the best centre half Stoke ever had is to say he will become the greatest English centre half ever because that is how good Franklin was. I don't remember Franklin but I used to discuss Stoke's defenders like Smith and Bloor with my dad. My dad reckoned he was as good a defender as Smith but much faster and most importantly, superb with the ball. Formations were different in those days but dad reckoned his ball control and passing was good enough for him to play for England in what we would now call central midfield as well as what we would call centre back. If he hadn't buggered his career up with the Bogota incident he'd have doubled his number of England caps, I think. And dad was unbiased - he supported Man Utd not Stoke.
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sargestokie
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Post by sargestokie on Mar 13, 2012 8:58:38 GMT
I agree that Shawcross is one of Tony's best signings. Playing with Abdoulaye really brought him on and then his partnership with Huth has helped to consolidate this.
I'd say Tony's best signings have been Fuller, Abdy Faye, Huth, Begovic, Sorenson, Etherington, Pennant and Shawcross.
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Post by robwahlmann on Mar 13, 2012 9:02:35 GMT
Ryan is an excellent defender, but he needs to improve his creative play to progress any further! First of all he must stop giving away throw ins at the rate he is doing! This I think is the worst part of his game that really should be easy to improve!
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Post by Olgrligm on Mar 13, 2012 9:12:40 GMT
Ryan is an excellent defender, but he needs to improve his creative play to progress any further! First of all he must stop giving away throw ins at the rate he is doing! This I think is the worst part of his game that really should be easy to improve! I think that's actually been coached into him, frustrating as it is. He was trying to defend a ball played into the channel once and got himself into all sorts of trouble, I think he either played a very dodgy backpass or gave away a set piece by trying to play his way out of the situation. Since then he's put the ball out for a throw every single time.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Mar 13, 2012 9:43:49 GMT
Shawcross is a great old-fashioned defender in the Tony Adams and Steve Bould mould. He very rarely gets in a mess, reads the game well and has the pace to cover gaps when needed.
Unfortunately football has moved on and the centre-halves rightly in my opinion need to contribute in the build up play and be able to pass to a team-mate.
I hate to say it but I think the truth is that Pulis' style clearly hasnt helped Ryan's development as a footballer. Hes clearly on orders to hoof the ball whenever he receives it. As much as we can moan about favouritism about the big clubs, its true that if Shawcross was at Man United now he would have probably learnt how to pass to a teammate. Look how well Smalling and Jones are improving at such a young age and are now ahead of Ryan for England recognition.
Ryan is clearly happy at Stoke and of course we gave him the break in the first-team he didnt look like getting at ManU. But I wonder if he had gone to another club where they actually like to pass the ball, if he could have developed better and become an England regular by now? Of course we'll never know
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Post by sheikhmomo on Mar 13, 2012 9:50:30 GMT
Both Ryan and Huth's no nonsense concession of throw ins particularly when they are facing their own goal is something I wholeheartedly approve of.
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Post by tqstokie on Mar 13, 2012 10:15:50 GMT
For me, Sir Stanley Mathews, closely followed by Jimmy McIlroy, Dennis Viollet, Alan Hudson and Jimmy Greenhoff. Dave Watson was a better centre half than Shawcross in my opinion. I never saw Franklin so cannot comment. As a partnership Overson and Cranson took some beating but IMO not better than Shawcross and Huth.
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Post by podolipotter on Mar 13, 2012 10:22:53 GMT
Got to be the return of Sir Stan. Crowd jumped from 8,000 to over 36,000 the next home game and of course he got us back to the First Division within 18 months and encouraged other "big names" to join us. I also believe that Ken Thomson was a better centre half than Shawcross, Cranson and Huth, but I never saw Franklin so cannot comment on him.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Mar 13, 2012 10:36:11 GMT
You'd have to say that John Ritchie at £2,500 was a decent bit of business! Even in those days £2,500 was peanuts. I know he never won an England cap but there have been scores of worse strikers who have played for England.
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Post by Old School Stokie on Mar 13, 2012 10:57:35 GMT
Not really if you are honest. Complacent at best. Needs to sharpen up a number of areas in his game. Pushing Shoving - passing - positional play weak - heading to a Stoke Player when not under pressure, getting more goals.
Apart from that - yes a bargain.
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Post by onionman on Mar 13, 2012 11:35:40 GMT
This notion that Pulis has somehow hindered Ryan's development as a footballer is one of the biggest myths on this messageboard.
When he came to Stoke, Ryan Shawcross was a nobody. Alex Ferguson didn't even think he would make the grade.
Under Pulis he's developed into arguably England's best defender.
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Post by vahl on Mar 13, 2012 11:54:21 GMT
This notion that Pulis has somehow hindered Ryan's development as a footballer is one of the biggest myths on this messageboard. When he came to Stoke, Ryan Shawcross was a nobody. Alex Ferguson didn't even think he would make the grade. Under Pulis he's developed into arguably England's best defender. I wouldn't go as far to say he's England's best defender because there is a pretty high standard of players to choose from and Ryan is more effective playing against physical strikers than those who are more technical. Sir Alex has actually been quoted before saying that he wishes he had kept Ryan at Utd as well - so he was well on the radar - in fact he was part of the whole De Laet saga and was recommended highly when he came.
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