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Post by drfootball on Feb 22, 2014 13:31:24 GMT
I was amused by the 4th or 5th item down the links list `Mass Hysteria`
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Post by ColonelMustard on Feb 22, 2014 13:57:23 GMT
Im no fan of Putin (nor Assad) but Putins opposition to the destabilisation/ regime change agenda in Syria was much needed. Putin has propped up a regime which has been involved in the deaths of some 100,000 Syrians. I fail to see how this could be counted as a success? There is a problem with the opposition which has grown as the conflict has dragged on Assad won't negotiate his own demise but there is no reason why his people could not take part in a multi faction government - but without him. Putin is the main reason for the stalemate and cares nothing for the loss of life the dispute has caused Groups of rebels against Syrian government forces? Stalemate caused by Russian support of the Syrian government? Hmmmm... a discussion for another thread another time
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Post by robinredcoat on Feb 22, 2014 14:11:24 GMT
I will never forget the two days spent in the Ukraine when we played out there, many many memorable moments not least the hospitality given to us by Den and his friends out there.
I remember a beautiful and fascinating city that I've always had a real desire to go back to. It was such a fascinating place to visit
Keep well and safe Den and all your family and friends. I hope that calm is restored soon to your homeland and whatever the politics, a better country for everyone emerges from this whole mess.
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Post by stokiejoeofalsager on Feb 22, 2014 14:29:40 GMT
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 22, 2014 14:47:36 GMT
I've read that one before. Loada bullshit!
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Post by magwitch on Feb 22, 2014 16:16:53 GMT
Assad has been in power now for a very long time. Nothing was said in the media for years about his regime, so why is it now being demonised? Much of the trouble in Syria came from foreign mercenries who were obviously paid and armed by those with a vested interest in removing him from power. There is no evidence that it was him who killed his own people, just as Gaddafi was unjustly accused in Libya. Putin expressed regret at what happened to Gaddafi and thought it wrong that he was not at the least captured and put on trial. He stopped a similar situation happening in Syria. MSM means mainstream media like the BBC. It is well-known that the BBC has become politicised and can no longer be trusted to report accurately as it used to do. Chemtrails are treated as a conspiracy theory by the BBC and others, but the evidence is overwhelming to anyone who investigates thoroughly. It is called geo-engineering by the US government, who are now quite open about it. Chemtrails are generally nanoparticles of aluminium oxide, barium and strontium. Contrails on the other hand are just water vapour which disappear very quickly, whilst chemtrails persist and expand for hours.Some landowners have tested the soil and found very high concentrations of these chemicals which could not have come from anywhere else.
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 22, 2014 19:03:37 GMT
Assad has been in power now for a very long time. Nothing was said in the media for years about his regime, so why is it now being demonised? Much of the trouble in Syria came from foreign mercenries who were obviously paid and armed by those with a vested interest in removing him from power. There is no evidence that it was him who killed his own people, just as Gaddafi was unjustly accused in Libya. Putin expressed regret at what happened to Gaddafi and thought it wrong that he was not at the least captured and put on trial. He stopped a similar situation happening in Syria. MSM means mainstream media like the BBC. It is well-known that the BBC has become politicised and can no longer be trusted to report accurately as it used to do. Chemtrails are treated as a conspiracy theory by the BBC and others, but the evidence is overwhelming to anyone who investigates thoroughly. It is called geo-engineering by the US government, who are now quite open about it. Chemtrails are generally nanoparticles of aluminium oxide, barium and strontium. Contrails on the other hand are just water vapour which disappear very quickly, whilst chemtrails persist and expand for hours.Some landowners have tested the soil and found very high concentrations of these chemicals which could not have come from anywhere else. Well I don't know what your news sources are that are more respected than the world renowned Beeb Assad and his sponsors, Russia and Iran, has been behind much of the trouble in the middle east for as long as he has been in office There are insurgents who have jumped on the back of the revolution but the vast bulk of the 100,000 opposition slaughtered by Assad are home bred civilians I have little doubt that Assad will be charged with crimes against humanity. As with Putin - he will do anything to stay in power
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Post by magwitch on Feb 23, 2014 10:19:34 GMT
Wisemaster: I have lived and worked in the Middle East for a number of years with syrians, palestinians, egyptians, arabs. indians, thailanders, etc. etc. I therefore have more than the usual interest in the area. I agree that the BBC has built an international reputation over the years after establishing it's credentials during WW2. But you may not know of the comparatively recent purges which have taken place of any journalist not willing to follow the lefty-liberal agenda. The BBC has it's own stance on the major issues of the day, such as Europe, rather than maintaining impartiality, which it is obliged to do under the governing charter. My information is gained from many sources and my views are formed partially from personal experience, from a knowledge of history, from listening to those with personal knowledge and contacts in the area, and from various sources in the alternative media which are growing almost on a daily basis. If you want to know who controls western governments, look at the top bankers: look at the history of the City of London, the Federal Reserve, the Khazars and the Rothschild family from the 17th century to the present. Why was Abraham Lincoln assassinated and why was Kennedy assassinated in 1963? You will not find out any of the real history of these subjects from watching the BBC, but they all have a bearing on what is happening today in the Middle East and elsewhere.
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 23, 2014 11:06:11 GMT
Magwich
You digress......
I do know a little about the history of the City of London which is a power base for the Jewish community and also became a power refuge for the weakened aristocracy. To this day the establishment continues to control our our country from this power base including the top public schools and the Lords
As for the middle east there appear to be two major and ancient problems. One of course is Israel which has used it's guarantor the USA to imprison the Palestinian nation. The other problem is the growing rift between the two major arms of the followers of Islam being Sunnis and Shiites
As ever these splits are all about power and control of one group over another which brings us back to Ukraine. Here we have the western leaning revolutionaries facing down the Putin backed eastern Ukraine of mainly Russian descent
Good luck to Ukraine - let us hope that sense prevails and we have a new government representing all the factions
Today with the release of Tymoshenko we can hope!!!!!
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Post by magwitch on Feb 23, 2014 11:49:41 GMT
Wisemaster: You think I digress! The problem in Ukraine is related to the ambitions of a handful of top bankers, just as it is in Libya, Syria and elsewhere. These conflicts only arise because someone is financing them for their own advantage. Our politicians say we are involved through humanitarian reasons. That is why dictators are demonised in the mainstream media,all owned and controlled by bankers. Dictators do kill their own people when they feel threatened. That is one of the many drawbacks of a dictatorship. But they are not all bad, and Gaddafi gave Libya the highest standard of living in Africa and had plans to rationalise the economies of the whole of the continent. That is why the bankers wanted him dead. Libya was one of a few countries without a Rothschild controlled central bank. Now they have one.....enough said. The City of London is not controlled by Jews. It is controlled by Zionists which is not the same thing. Real jews are descendents of the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, whilst a Zionist need have no jewish genealogy whatsoever. Many people hiding behind judaism are in fact Khazars who are not descended from the twelve tribes of Israel but adopted the jewish faith about 1200 years ago. The name Rothschild actually means red shield and was adopted by a german family called Bauer in the 18th century. The Bauers were coin merchants in Frankfurt and were Khazars. In the year 1900 it was estimated that the Rothschilds owned 50% of the total wealth of the World. As for Putin, he understands what is going on and has expelled the Rothschilds and their agents out of Russia. This is massively to Russia's advantage, and will be to the advantage of Ukraine if they can keep the Rothschilds out. I think only Putin can prevent this, so his protection will be of huge benefit to the future of Ukraine.
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Post by andystokey on Feb 23, 2014 18:22:16 GMT
I will never forget the two days spent in the Ukraine when we played out there, many many memorable moments not least the hospitality given to us by Den and his friends out there. I remember a beautiful and fascinating city that I've always had a real desire to go back to. It was such a fascinating place to visit Keep well and safe Den and all your family and friends. I hope that calm is restored soon to your homeland and whatever the politics, a better country for everyone emerges from this whole mess. All of this
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 26, 2014 14:12:17 GMT
Still worying news from Ukraine - mainly of course due to Russian politicians stirring up separatist moves in the Crimea
Magwitch - you seem to have 'Great Expectations' of Ukraine's Russian Neighbours?
See the comments today from Georgia's ex president Saakashvili...
He claims that disgraced Ukraine president Yanukovych regularly bragged about his ability to corrupt officials and in particular the courts - all this whilst lining his own pockets The ex Georgian president's comments are particularly apt - 'This is a very Soviet mentality; Stalin used to sign off the verdict on every serous court case'
For Soviet mentality read 'Putin' - the case is made!
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Post by davejohnno1 on Feb 26, 2014 14:47:51 GMT
As great as the Ukraine was, and it was absolutely fantastic for the 3 days that we were there, the whole issue of the country being corrupt shouldn't come as a surprise.
When Police approach visitors, demand presentation of your passport and then force you to buy it back from them, it is fairly obvious the corruption runs throughout the country's government and agencies of government/law enforcement.
It is still a shock to see the situation on TV though and as others have said, hopefully the friends that we made in Kiev, namely Den, are all safe and well.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2014 15:45:21 GMT
Isn't POOB over in Kiev?
i bet she started the whole bloody thing....women!
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Post by denfcdk on Feb 27, 2014 22:31:49 GMT
THANK YOU, GUYS! Just have seen ALL your warm words of support & concern. It means a lot for us. Really. THANK YOU! For those talking about putin. Believe me, it s very sad, but for many years Russian regime have been the most unfriendly, dangerous for Ukraine. It s our main external problem, threat. And that is maybe the only reason personally I want Ukraine to join the EU (trust me we are not big fans of EU). To get further from Russian "friendship". Which is FAR from friendship. For putin it s hard to accept that Ukraine doesn t treat Russia as a "bigger" brother. We are Independent free country & we don t want back to ussr. We are European country. We want to move forward. And the protests were NOT for EU etc. People wanted FREEDOM and DIGNITY and better future. People want to decide which way their country should go. It s after people to decide, not after couple of corrupt criminals. Now it s important for us to stay together and build better, stronger Ukraine.
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Feb 27, 2014 22:42:52 GMT
THANK YOU, GUYS! Just have seen ALL your warm words of support & concern. It means a lot for us. Really. THANK YOU! For those talking about putin. Believe me, it s very sad, but for many years Russian regime have been the most unfriendly, dangerous for Ukraine. It s our main external problem, threat. And that is maybe the only reason personally I want Ukraine to join the EU (trust me we are not big fans of EU). To get further from Russian "friendship". Which is FAR from friendship. For putin it s hard to accept that Ukraine doesn t treat Russia as a "bigger" brother. We are Independent free country & we don t want back to ussr. We are European country. We want to move forward. And the protests were NOT for EU etc. People wanted FREEDOM and DIGNITY and better future. People want to decide which way their country should go. It s after people to decide, not after couple of corrupt criminals. Now it s important for us to stay together and build better, stronger Ukraine. Best of luck Den and I hope you've seen the last of the violence. Unfortunately I don't think you have. Putin won't take this lying down and there are enough pro Russians in the south and east of Ukraine to cause serious problems for a very fragile government and economy. Is partition a likely outcome?
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Post by magwitch on Feb 28, 2014 11:36:13 GMT
Wisemaster: I am pleased to see you are familiar with the works of H.G.Wells. You may not know that Wells was an insider who received much of his material from the illuminati.The issue of Ukraine is not as simple as you have described. If an American puppet government is installed in Ukraine, Russia will feel threatened by possible military bases on its borders. I do not believe Putin is trying to build a new Russian empire. The collapse of the old Soviet Union should have been a lesson to him. American aggression is a problem for him to deal with, and this explains a lot that is going on at present in Ukraine and elsewhere. The present American government is illigitimate. Obama is a muslim who was born in Kenya, therefore is not qualified to be president. Many people in the USA now realise the nature of his government and what it is trying to do. The support for his foreign policy is extremely low, as is his personal popularity. There are a number of efforts to remove him from office by impeachment. He has suspended habeus corpus by executive order giving himself the right to imprison anyone indefinitely, and can legally murder anyone he decides is a threat despite lack of evidence of criminal activity. The American multinational, Monsanto, has a huge stake in the chemtrail business but now has legal protection in the USA against being sued for their many misdeeds. This is obviously fascist. The White House is afraid of revolution and being held accountable for their crimes not only in foreign policy but against their own people.
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 28, 2014 12:32:02 GMT
THANK YOU, GUYS! Just have seen ALL your warm words of support & concern. It means a lot for us. Really. THANK YOU! For those talking about putin. Believe me, it s very sad, but for many years Russian regime have been the most unfriendly, dangerous for Ukraine. It s our main external problem, threat. And that is maybe the only reason personally I want Ukraine to join the EU (trust me we are not big fans of EU). To get further from Russian "friendship". Which is FAR from friendship. For putin it s hard to accept that Ukraine doesn t treat Russia as a "bigger" brother. We are Independent free country & we don t want back to ussr. We are European country. We want to move forward. And the protests were NOT for EU etc. People wanted FREEDOM and DIGNITY and better future. People want to decide which way their country should go. It s after people to decide, not after couple of corrupt criminals. Now it s important for us to stay together and build better, stronger Ukraine. Good luck Den Overall the EU is a force for good if it delegates power I reckon that you may have to lose the Crimea which might be a good thing except that you would then be land locked which wouldn't be good - how do the Kiev folk feel about that?
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 28, 2014 12:48:17 GMT
Wisemaster: I am pleased to see you are familiar with the works of H.G.Wells. You may not know that Wells was an insider who received much of his material from the illuminati.The issue of Ukraine is not as simple as you have described. If an American puppet government is installed in Ukraine, Russia will feel threatened by possible military bases on its borders. I do not believe Putin is trying to build a new Russian empire. The collapse of the old Soviet Union should have been a lesson to him. American aggression is a problem for him to deal with, and this explains a lot that is going on at present in Ukraine and elsewhere. The present American government is illigitimate. Obama is a muslim who was born in Kenya, therefore is not qualified to be president. Many people in the USA now realise the nature of his government and what it is trying to do. The support for his foreign policy is extremely low, as is his personal popularity. There are a number of efforts to remove him from office by impeachment. He has suspended habeus corpus by executive order giving himself the right to imprison anyone indefinitely, and can legally murder anyone he decides is a threat despite lack of evidence of criminal activity. The American multinational, Monsanto, has a huge stake in the chemtrail business but now has legal protection in the USA against being sued for their many misdeeds. This is obviously fascist. The White House is afraid of revolution and being held accountable for their crimes not only in foreign policy but against their own people. Magwich - were you being intentionally humorous? Magwich being a Dickens character!! lol Check out the post from Den above to see what Ukraine people feel about Putin (excluding Crimea of course). They are right to be worried - Putin is very much a Soviet era man indeed he was a top man in the KGB was he not? As for Obama, only the extreme right could describe him as illegitimate and fascist. Obama has every right to be president, indeed he is probably the most liberal president since Kennedy though that is not saying much for the USA. Sadly Obama has been hamstrung by the right wing establishment - so many of his policies will not come to fruition You are beginning to sound a little obsessed with the USA - no?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2014 14:56:39 GMT
I've been to Kiev a few times myself and was there on Monday and Tuesday. Thankfully I was not around on 18th February. This is based on an email I sent to many people in my address book on Monday. I wont upload the photo's on to the board itself, but if anybody wants them, PM me and I can email:
(February 24th, 2014 ) I have come here many times and still will do so, that most certainly hasn't changed and neither has my love of the city, the country and every person I have had the pleasure to meet. But what has happened here recently is something I just can't come to grips with. The more I have tried to, the more I realise that I simply cannot do so.
I've been to Maidan today, the place 'where it happened'. There is no celebration of freedom, independence or victory... just sadness, shock and distress over what happened and all the lives lost. I felt that it was important to go and see it all whilst I'm here otherwise it would have been somewhat ignorant of me to not do so. It just felt so numb - so numb that I couldn't actually feel anything at all.
Last time I was here, I came to the same places in the hot sun and now it is full of people in mourning. The ground is covered in black from all the fires; informal walkways created between rows of flowers/candles and barricades; tributes where people had been killed...but people who are STILL there despite what happened. People aged between 17 and 73 picked off by snipers on top of the most iconic hotel in the city centre is something that I could never even begin to understand.
Of the photographs I didn't take were two funeral services taking place. You also don't get to 'hear' anything from photo's or smell the air. The noise...well, it was just silence broken only by those in tears. It's actually quite haunting. The smell is one that I still have on my jacket. It somehow seems wrong though to just wash it off and carry on.
I was walking today among many people who had actually been there and witnessed this first hand whilst it was happening. It's hard to say whether I think they are heroes for standing up for what they did; as I'm sure they wouldn't want the accolade and would only grant any such status for those who were killed. I've never been in a position where i've been given the choice between standing peacefully in protest or staying and being classed as part of a terrorist movement. No matter what, they are most certainly victims of greed, corruption and modern day geopolitics.
It's very easy for people from the outside to be 'shocked' at the videos on the news. But how many of us have ever been in a situation where we have felt the need to protest for months in the face of great danger from radicals (who have used the protest as an excuse to cause violence); paid government thugs to invoke violence to give police 'justification' for retaliating with force, and police ordered to move by force peaceful protesters - who announced before their move for 'women and children to leave before they commence an anti-terror operation'. How many of us have ever gone to our hotel lobby on holiday to see it being used as a make shift hospital to treat the injured and keeping the dead - needed because those who were taken to hospital were kidnapped, taken many miles outside Kiev, badly beaten (if lucky), stripped naked, doused in ice cold water then dumped in -20 degree temperatures? How many of us have ever walked in somewhere like Trafalgar Square in the sight of sniper rifles?
Very easy for people (including me) to judge indeed, yet this is a country not even 23 years free from its Independence; split fiercely between the centre and west who want closer ties with Europe, and the south and east who want to keep ties with Russia (and even re-unification). It is a country riddled with corruption throughout its ruling structures. A country which, on the morning of 22nd February having seen its President, politicians and oligarchs FLEE Kiev (and in some cases, unsuccessfully, the country) - leaving a state budget of ZERO [their currency in this week alone has fallen by approximately 40%]! A country that has so far seen two 'revolutions' in its young lifetime fueled by that anger against corruption. [see note at the end of this post]
Yet its a country full of determined people; warm and welcoming who take great pride in who they are and where they are from. Where many people have nothing, get given nothing, take nothing but still somehow get by. They don't deserve this, no member of the public of any country does.
I hope that nobody ever has to face that kind of situation ever again, but they sadly will. I'll probably again be 'shocked' by the video's on television and reports on the internet too (as I have with events in Egypt, Syria, Bahrain, Thailand, Venezuela)...but I will never be in a position where I can understand judge with qualification what is happening and certainly aren't with this either. In fact, it perfectly summarises the situation that only now, despite all that has gone on throughout the world, has something like this actually affected me so much.
The next time I think that I'm being hard done to or suffering for some reason, I will think back to today and what I have seen (and most importantly what I have not seen) and get a bit of perspective. I'm also certainly no expert on this matter either just because I have seen a small part of the aftermath.
A number of people I sent this too wrote in response that they couldnt imagine how I must have felt...but that again completely missing the entire point. It's not about what I saw at all, it's about what went on before. It's about trying to share with a few more people what it was like afterwards without any kind of agenda other than passing on information.
For anybody with interest in international politics and events, here is a very interesting documentary regarding the 2004 Orange Revolution. A section from around 20:40 shows exactly why these events took a more serious and deadly twist, that being the violence with the police. It has to be acknowledged that violence was NEVER promoted or supported by the protest movement and took place away from the square in a single location.
The noted extract was a national deputy giving a speech at the borderline between rows of police and a mass of protesters: You have heeded your duty from Yulia Tymoshenko to stand here. At this minute, decisions are being made as to the future steps. I ask of you, the next couple of minutes, maybe 20, maybe 30, maybe 1 hour, maybe 2, we must stand here. No one here is getting paid, everyone came here from the motivations of their heart. and even though you may get cold, we must stand here. I ask you, sincerely, to understand a couple of things. In front of you stands a barrier [of police]. This is not just a stupid wall. This is our brother. These are our brothers. God forbid any one of you think this is our enemy. This is not the enemy, these are our Ukrainian brothers. Simply, for 13 years, they were commanded by bandits, and today are forced to follow orders. And today we have a president, a Ukrainian president. These boys made obligations, not to Kuchma or Yanukovich, they are under oath to the Ukrainian people, laws and constitution, and they will follow them. And again I ask of you, God forbid, we disrespect them. We must approach them with love and say, God forbid, God forbid, that you raise your hand against your sister or brother. And like so, we must continue to stand!
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 28, 2014 17:46:26 GMT
If that post doesn't answer Mr Magwich above then nothing will
Russian officials generally are bullies brought up for centuries on treading on people. See how they treated the western Greenpeace group
Away from the camera ordinary people have no chance against such aggression
Good luck to them - top post stanground
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Post by Laughing Gravy on Feb 28, 2014 17:56:10 GMT
If that post doesn't answer Mr Magwich above then nothing will Russian officials generally are bullies brought up for centuries on treading on people. See how they treated the western Greenpeace group Away from the camera ordinary people have no chance against such aggression Good luck to them - top post stanground Yeah but old Maggies just a WUM isn't he?
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Post by TheWiseMaster on Feb 28, 2014 18:46:39 GMT
If that post doesn't answer Mr Magwich above then nothing will Russian officials generally are bullies brought up for centuries on treading on people. See how they treated the western Greenpeace group Away from the camera ordinary people have no chance against such aggression Good luck to them - top post stanground Yeah but old Maggies just a WUM isn't he? Maybe a WUM - more likely deluded!
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Post by magwitch on Feb 28, 2014 21:16:50 GMT
Yes WM, magwitch is a Dickens character. But if you think Obama is the most liberal president since Kennedy, you are on a different planet than me and, I suspect. a large majority of Americans. Kennedy would have gone down in history as one of the great presidents. Obama will be considered the worst. His agenda is to ruin America, and he is succeeding. Like most of the British public, I am very sorry for what is happening in Ukraine but I differ from you if you seriously believe that the EU is the answer to the troubles. The EU is run by 27 unelected bureaucrats, shortly to be reduced to 6. The majority of these people came from the former Soviet Union so are ex-communists, and many have criminal convictions. There is no democracy in the EU, and it is rapidly heading for a dictatorship.
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Post by denfcdk on Jan 3, 2015 21:58:18 GMT
Hello, guys! Haven t been here for such a long time. First of all, I want to say THANK YOU to all our Friends from Stoke-on-Trent (and the rest of UK) for their support to Ukraine. It means A LOT. Really.
It s amazing that we ve found real Friends after that Europa League match in Kyiv in 2011. I am not often visitor of "oatcake" now, but we stay in touch on facebook and - what is much more important - in real life! Two of our friends are now in Kyiv (for New Year celebrations), by the way. Sure, I want to send our best wishes to you, your families, your city & your Club! I sincerely wish you to get to EuroCups this season! Club with such great supporters should play in Europe every season. Hope to see you, guys, soon! You are ALWAYS welcome in Ukraine.
Den
Kyiv / Stoke-on-Trent
P.S. UTMP!!
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Post by flea79 on Jan 3, 2015 22:06:15 GMT
Hello, guys! Haven t been here for such a long time. First of all, I want to say THANK YOU to all our Friends from Stoke-on-Trent (and the rest of UK) for their support to Ukraine. It means A LOT. Really. It s amazing that we ve found real Friends after that Europa League match in Kyiv in 2011. I am not often visitor of "oatcake" now, but we stay in touch on facebook and - what is much more important - in real life! Two of our friends are now in Kyiv (for New Year celebrations), by the way. Sure, I want to send our best wishes to you, your families, your city & your Club! I sincerely wish you to get to EuroCups this season! Club with such great supporters should play in Europe every season. Hope to see you, guys, soon! You are ALWAYS welcome in Ukraine. Den Kyiv / Stoke-on-Trent P.S. UTMP!! Seasons greetings to you too! May your year be full of vodka and victories on the pitch and off
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Post by theonlywayisstoke on Jan 3, 2015 22:19:16 GMT
I think we can all say, football is the real winner here *Alan Partridge voice*
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Post by riccyfuller93 on Jan 3, 2015 22:21:53 GMT
Greetings sir
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Post by IvKorzh on Jan 3, 2015 23:47:53 GMT
Sorry Stokies, but i prefer chatting with our Ukrainian friends in Russian or Ukrainian, not in English ??????? ??????? ?????! ??? ?? ???? ???????, ??? ??? ??????. ????? ??? ? ??????. ??????, ?? ????? ???, ?? ????????. ? ????? ?????!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2015 11:50:05 GMT
Hello, guys! Haven t been here for such a long time. First of all, I want to say THANK YOU to all our Friends from Stoke-on-Trent (and the rest of UK) for their support to Ukraine. It means A LOT. Really. It s amazing that we ve found real Friends after that Europa League match in Kyiv in 2011. I am not often visitor of "oatcake" now, but we stay in touch on facebook and - what is much more important - in real life! Two of our friends are now in Kyiv (for New Year celebrations), by the way. Sure, I want to send our best wishes to you, your families, your city & your Club! I sincerely wish you to get to EuroCups this season! Club with such great supporters should play in Europe every season. Hope to see you, guys, soon! You are ALWAYS welcome in Ukraine. Den Kyiv / Stoke-on-Trent P.S. UTMP!! ?????????? ???, ? ??????????? ?????? ????. ?? ? ???? ???????? ???????? ? ???? 7-?? ??????, ??? ?????? ????? ????? ????. ? ???? ???????? ?? ?????? ? ????? ??????? ? ??????. ???? ? ???? ????? ????????? ?????, ? ?????? ???. ????
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